Posted by: paul on 3:21pm Fri 16 Mar 07
As if the streets of Glasgow are not bad enough, I dont know why the people who let these people in dont put them on an island millions of miles away and leave them there.Everybodys happy then.
As if the streets of Glasgow are not bad enough, I dont know why the people who let these people in dont put them on an island millions of miles away and leave them there.Everybodys happy then.
Posted by: paul on 3:22pm Fri 16 Mar 07
As if the streets of Glasgow are not bad enough, I dont know why the people who let these people in dont put them on an island millions of miles away and leave them there.Everybodys happy then.
As if the streets of Glasgow are not bad enough, I dont know why the people who let these people in dont put them on an island millions of miles away and leave them there.Everybodys happy then.
Posted by: Thomas, Glasgow on 4:11pm Fri 16 Mar 07
There has been a profound change in Govanhill in the last couple of years. The racial mix has changed with a very large number of economic migrants from other parts of the EU - as well as a smattering of refugees from various parts of the world. All seem temporary and all seem suspicious and hostile to the host Scottish population. There has been a large Asian population in the South Side of Glasgow - who in my opinion are a very insular group who have little or nothing in common with the Scottish population. Even after a couple of generations they want to remain estranged. Wearing costumes from a different culture. Indeed when asked they will always describe themselves as Pakistani (etc.)
Many Asian teenagers have their own distinct accent - a sure sign that they spend little time with and have no allegiance to the general population of Scots.
In my opinion there are far too many people in the South Side of Glasgow who owe no allegiance to and care little about Scotland - and after all why should they. We have been told for years that we live in a multi-cultural society. The fruits of that is the establishment of small pockets of foreigners in our midst for the forseeable future - perhaps generations.
What I think is the biggest worry and extreme frustration to the Scottish population WE WERE NEVER ASKED!!!
There has been a profound change in Govanhill in the last couple of years. The racial mix has changed with a very large number of economic migrants from other parts of the EU - as well as a smattering of refugees from various parts of the world. All seem temporary and all seem suspicious and hostile to the host Scottish population. There has been a large Asian population in the South Side of Glasgow - who in my opinion are a very insular group who have little or nothing in common with the Scottish population. Even after a couple of generations they want to remain estranged. Wearing costumes from a different culture. Indeed when asked they will always describe themselves as Pakistani (etc.)
Many Asian teenagers have their own distinct accent - a sure sign that they spend little time with and have no allegiance to the general population of Scots.
In my opinion there are far too many people in the South Side of Glasgow who owe no allegiance to and care little about Scotland - and after all why should they. We have been told for years that we live in a multi-cultural society. The fruits of that is the establishment of small pockets of foreigners in our midst for the forseeable future - perhaps generations.
What I think is the biggest worry and extreme frustration to the Scottish population WE WERE NEVER ASKED!!!
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 4:26pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Where on earth do we start?
First of all we need to drop the shock headlines and billboards of race riots and battlefields.
Our streets do need saving but the Slovaks need saving from the poverty and overcrowding in which they have been left.
Who is paying their rent? They don't seem to work? Are they refugees?
If they are being state funded then the state needs to get down here and crack down on the slumlords who are taking these people for a ride.
Whatever happened to the truant officer? Get the kids to school, teach them English, give them an education and a chance.
Teach the adults English, give them a chance too.
Just don't leave them to wallow in poverty.
Whilst I don't agree with Paul's comments I can understand his frustration. When you are poor and bored you will hang about the streets. It looks intimidating and one thing can then lead to another.
However, it has to work on both sides. Just because you are poor and bored doesn't give you the right to sing at 1am. And frankly, their singing is rank rotten. And the bottle recycling bin is not a supply of delicate footballs.
Something has to be done. It has to start with the council and social work. They will have to be proactive.
Where on earth do we start?
First of all we need to drop the shock headlines and billboards of race riots and battlefields.
Our streets do need saving but the Slovaks need saving from the poverty and overcrowding in which they have been left.
Who is paying their rent? They don't seem to work? Are they refugees?
If they are being state funded then the state needs to get down here and crack down on the slumlords who are taking these people for a ride.
Whatever happened to the truant officer? Get the kids to school, teach them English, give them an education and a chance.
Teach the adults English, give them a chance too.
Just don't leave them to wallow in poverty.
Whilst I don't agree with Paul's comments I can understand his frustration. When you are poor and bored you will hang about the streets. It looks intimidating and one thing can then lead to another.
However, it has to work on both sides. Just because you are poor and bored doesn't give you the right to sing at 1am. And frankly, their singing is rank rotten. And the bottle recycling bin is not a supply of delicate footballs.
Something has to be done. It has to start with the council and social work. They will have to be proactive.
Posted by: Doug, Cathcart on 4:30pm Fri 16 Mar 07
When the Irish, Italians and the Jews came here decades ago the self-same things as said by these 2 borderline racists above were said. However, many of us, myself included are descended from these immigrants. And don't the British keep to their own enclaves and wear their own clothes, listen to their own music and enjoy their own culture when they buy up homes in the mediterranean, eastern Europe and north Africa? But that's alright isn't it, because they are not somehow "foreign" - we all know the undercurrent of what these people are saying.
Where is the tolerance we are supposed to be known for?
When the Irish, Italians and the Jews came here decades ago the self-same things as said by these 2 borderline racists above were said. However, many of us, myself included are descended from these immigrants. And don't the British keep to their own enclaves and wear their own clothes, listen to their own music and enjoy their own culture when they buy up homes in the mediterranean, eastern Europe and north Africa? But that's alright isn't it, because they are not somehow "foreign" - we all know the undercurrent of what these people are saying.
Where is the tolerance we are supposed to be known for?
Posted by: Doug on 4:32pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Good to see a sensible, rational tone from you as usual Grant - and you live relatively close by to this so-called flashpoint area.
Good to see a sensible, rational tone from you as usual Grant - and you live relatively close by to this so-called flashpoint area.
Posted by: Riz (Eastborn), Govanhill on 4:41pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Grant, I like alot in what your saying. As a fellow Govanhill resident I am sickened by some peoples replies here. I myself as some of you may know was in trouble and put on the front page of the Evening Times as I was threatened with an ASBO ... Why? Because I was teling kids to cover ove Racist Graffitti in Govanhill!
The Evening Tmes has alot to answer for in my book. They covered my ASBO, but when I put on a football competiton for Show Racism The ed Card WHERE WAS THE COVEREAGE FROM THE PAPER THEN? NOWHERE!! Shock headlines like this will cause more trouble than good!!! The Good peope of Govanhill will continue to help those in Govanhill Im sure, but articles like this are blowing things out of proportion and helping NOONE!
Grant, I like alot in what your saying. As a fellow Govanhill resident I am sickened by some peoples replies here. I myself as some of you may know was in trouble and put on the front page of the Evening Times as I was threatened with an ASBO ... Why? Because I was teling kids to cover ove Racist Graffitti in Govanhill!
The Evening Tmes has alot to answer for in my book. They covered my ASBO, but when I put on a football competiton for Show Racism The ed Card WHERE WAS THE COVEREAGE FROM THE PAPER THEN? NOWHERE!! Shock headlines like this will cause more trouble than good!!! The Good peope of Govanhill will continue to help those in Govanhill Im sure, but articles like this are blowing things out of proportion and helping NOONE!
Posted by: Riz (Eastborn), Govanhill on 4:46pm Fri 16 Mar 07
... ps the sining aint that bad ... REALLY annoying tho, and altho I dont agree with the racists (Obviously) you can see there arguement in the fact that if it was Scottish kids they would be jailed instantly, the Police really dont know how to handle the situation. Lack of education, funds and resources is to blame, and Yes I agree that people in Govanhill should be made aware who is moving in.. I dont mind help my fellow man at all, but a little bit of advanced education would be nice! I mean, who in Govanhill these days even knows thier own neighbour?
... ps the sining aint that bad ... REALLY annoying tho, and altho I dont agree with the racists (Obviously) you can see there arguement in the fact that if it was Scottish kids they would be jailed instantly, the Police really dont know how to handle the situation. Lack of education, funds and resources is to blame, and Yes I agree that people in Govanhill should be made aware who is moving in.. I dont mind help my fellow man at all, but a little bit of advanced education would be nice! I mean, who in Govanhill these days even knows thier own neighbour?
Posted by: Thomas, Glasgow on 4:57pm Fri 16 Mar 07
I live in Govanhill - within earshot of these Slovak Gypsies.
Are they refurees? Are they opressed in Slovakia? Shouldn't the EU be sorting that out for a member state like Slovakia?
I have visited Slovakia twice it is a lovely little country - much like Scotland in many ways - an active educated population.
I have a feeling as they live in private accomodation that they are ecconomic migrants - and if so then they should be governed by market forces. If they can't speak English and have no tallents to offer Britain's second fastest growing city then they should go back to Slovakia. That isn't racist that is just how the EU works.
Why should that been entertained here?
Why should we be responsible for educating their children?
Why should they be treated any differently from any ecconomic migrant in Europe?
Why should we have to pay for they benefits claim to be translated for them?
I have been stopped by Slovakian women countless times on Victoria Road and been shown their little cards with the begging message. I have been accosted by the little children looking for money. Seen the families as they go down to the local Buroo looking for handouts - which I presume are better than whet they were getting in Slovakia and therefore that is whey they are here - Benefit migrants.
I live in Govanhill - within earshot of these Slovak Gypsies.
Are they refurees? Are they opressed in Slovakia? Shouldn't the EU be sorting that out for a member state like Slovakia?
I have visited Slovakia twice it is a lovely little country - much like Scotland in many ways - an active educated population.
I have a feeling as they live in private accomodation that they are ecconomic migrants - and if so then they should be governed by market forces. If they can't speak English and have no tallents to offer Britain's second fastest growing city then they should go back to Slovakia. That isn't racist that is just how the EU works.
Why should that been entertained here?
Why should we be responsible for educating their children?
Why should they be treated any differently from any ecconomic migrant in Europe?
Why should we have to pay for they benefits claim to be translated for them?
I have been stopped by Slovakian women countless times on Victoria Road and been shown their little cards with the begging message. I have been accosted by the little children looking for money. Seen the families as they go down to the local Buroo looking for handouts - which I presume are better than whet they were getting in Slovakia and therefore that is whey they are here - Benefit migrants.
Posted by: Thomas, Glasgow on 4:58pm Fri 16 Mar 07
I live in Govanhill - within earshot of these Slovak Gypsies.
Are they refurees? Are they opressed in Slovakia? Shouldn't the EU be sorting that out for a member state like Slovakia?
I have visited Slovakia twice it is a lovely little country - much like Scotland in many ways - an active educated population.
I have a feeling as they live in private accomodation that they are ecconomic migrants - and if so then they should be governed by market forces. If they can't speak English and have no tallents to offer Britain's second fastest growing city then they should go back to Slovakia. That isn't racist that is just how the EU works.
Why should that been entertained here?
Why should we be responsible for educating their children?
Why should they be treated any differently from any ecconomic migrant in Europe?
Why should we have to pay for they benefits claim to be translated for them?
I have been stopped by Slovakian women countless times on Victoria Road and been shown their little cards with the begging message. I have been accosted by the little children looking for money. Seen the families as they go down to the local Buroo looking for handouts - which I presume are better than whet they were getting in Slovakia and therefore that is whey they are here - Benefit migrants.
I live in Govanhill - within earshot of these Slovak Gypsies.
Are they refurees? Are they opressed in Slovakia? Shouldn't the EU be sorting that out for a member state like Slovakia?
I have visited Slovakia twice it is a lovely little country - much like Scotland in many ways - an active educated population.
I have a feeling as they live in private accomodation that they are ecconomic migrants - and if so then they should be governed by market forces. If they can't speak English and have no tallents to offer Britain's second fastest growing city then they should go back to Slovakia. That isn't racist that is just how the EU works.
Why should that been entertained here?
Why should we be responsible for educating their children?
Why should they be treated any differently from any ecconomic migrant in Europe?
Why should we have to pay for they benefits claim to be translated for them?
I have been stopped by Slovakian women countless times on Victoria Road and been shown their little cards with the begging message. I have been accosted by the little children looking for money. Seen the families as they go down to the local Buroo looking for handouts - which I presume are better than whet they were getting in Slovakia and therefore that is whey they are here - Benefit migrants.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 5:01pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Yeah, I was being a bit facetious about the singing. But it does tend to be constant and annoying. Normally, if it's some drunk Celtic or Rangers fan they'll be on their way in around 30 seconds.
I'm sure it's great in their culture. If the kids could be brought into the community then maybe their singing could be channeled. Stick a track behind it, get them a MySpace page and get them a hit. Of course, that's a long **** as no Asian music has really made a crossover.
We need something like the project Hugh Reed runs in Royston.
I know I've got a lot of the questions and none of the answers. At least you've made an effort Riz.
Yeah, I was being a bit facetious about the singing. But it does tend to be constant and annoying. Normally, if it's some drunk Celtic or Rangers fan they'll be on their way in around 30 seconds.
I'm sure it's great in their culture. If the kids could be brought into the community then maybe their singing could be channeled. Stick a track behind it, get them a MySpace page and get them a hit. Of course, that's a long **** as no Asian music has really made a crossover.
We need something like the project Hugh Reed runs in Royston.
I know I've got a lot of the questions and none of the answers. At least you've made an effort Riz.
Posted by: unknown, europe on 5:03pm Fri 16 Mar 07
I fully agree with Doug and Robina Qureshi's comments. These people need help and assistance they came here in search of a new life from terrible conditions and poverty. I know what it is like to try a new life in a foreign country to try to learn another language . It is very difficult and I wasn't fleeing any of the conditions that these people have had to endure.
I fully agree with Doug and Robina Qureshi's comments. These people need help and assistance they came here in search of a new life from terrible conditions and poverty. I know what it is like to try a new life in a foreign country to try to learn another language . It is very difficult and I wasn't fleeing any of the conditions that these people have had to endure.
Posted by: Doug, Cathcart on 5:06pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Just a comment, immigrants coming from the accession countries are NOT eligible for JSA - if you don't believe me, then check with your local office in Devon Place.
They come here to do the jobs folk here won't do, in hospitality, cleaning and seasonal work.
Having done it myself, I can say it isn't pleasant, but at least the minimum wage helps.
And witness the fuss made when Gordon Brown rightly said all immigrants and newcomers to the UK should learn English. It only helps to be part of the society in which you live. You know how difficult it is when trying to converse with Greek waiters for a fortnight when you don't speak the language so imagine that 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not good for anyone.
Just a comment, immigrants coming from the accession countries are NOT eligible for JSA - if you don't believe me, then check with your local office in Devon Place.
They come here to do the jobs folk here won't do, in hospitality, cleaning and seasonal work.
Having done it myself, I can say it isn't pleasant, but at least the minimum wage helps.
And witness the fuss made when Gordon Brown rightly said all immigrants and newcomers to the UK should learn English. It only helps to be part of the society in which you live. You know how difficult it is when trying to converse with Greek waiters for a fortnight when you don't speak the language so imagine that 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not good for anyone.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 5:14pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Not sure why the profanity checker got me there. Must have been a typo, sorry. I and o are right next to each other. I need a sub-editor.
Thomas, I don't know the answer to your questions. They are similar to some my own. Although, whilst a child is actually living here for an extended period of time they should attend school. That, I believe, is how most countries on the planet operate. And should be a basic right of any child.
Not sure why the profanity checker got me there. Must have been a typo, sorry. I and o are right next to each other. I need a sub-editor.
Thomas, I don't know the answer to your questions. They are similar to some my own. Although, whilst a child is actually living here for an extended period of time they should attend school. That, I believe, is how most countries on the planet operate. And should be a basic right of any child.
Posted by: Varoomshka on 5:19pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Thomas, you are supremely ignorant man. Not your fault but you need to learn true facts. East European people come to work. They do not get benefits or rent allowances. Their kids should go to schools paid for by taxes their parents pay.
Big problem is maybe gangmasters and sleazy landlords exploit them. Who owns house they live in? How much they pay in rent? Are they getting minimum wage? Is gangmaster/mafia person taxing them?
Is serious problem. If Thomas really want to help, find out who are landlords and gangmasters.
Thomas, you are supremely ignorant man. Not your fault but you need to learn true facts. East European people come to work. They do not get benefits or rent allowances. Their kids should go to schools paid for by taxes their parents pay.
Big problem is maybe gangmasters and sleazy landlords exploit them. Who owns house they live in? How much they pay in rent? Are they getting minimum wage? Is gangmaster/mafia person taxing them?
Is serious problem. If Thomas really want to help, find out who are landlords and gangmasters.
Posted by: John, S.Side on 5:31pm Fri 16 Mar 07
why is it if u have anything negative to say about these immigrants you call them a racist, pauls views are spot on to a certain degree, why are these ppl here, i certainly had no say in this and none of my friends or family did either. it seems these asians and such are causing far more trouble than benefits, although obviously there are law abiding hardworking individuals, just like these Czecks and such. i find it hilarious how you ppl want the government to spend more and more money on these ppl, do we not have troubles of our own, oh yeh, and dont forget the english need 9billion, most likely a lot of it our taxes, to pay for their olympic games, and their supercasino etc etc.
bottom line... its wrong to let these people into this country when this country had so many problems to begin with.
why is it if u have anything negative to say about these immigrants you call them a racist, pauls views are spot on to a certain degree, why are these ppl here, i certainly had no say in this and none of my friends or family did either. it seems these asians and such are causing far more trouble than benefits, although obviously there are law abiding hardworking individuals, just like these Czecks and such. i find it hilarious how you ppl want the government to spend more and more money on these ppl, do we not have troubles of our own, oh yeh, and dont forget the english need 9billion, most likely a lot of it our taxes, to pay for their olympic games, and their supercasino etc etc.
bottom line... its wrong to let these people into this country when this country had so many problems to begin with.
Posted by: Rosie on 5:35pm Fri 16 Mar 07
I'm sickened by some of the early comments here. I live in Govanhill and I have to say the shock horror headlines do not represent the facts. For a start Govanhill is, and always has been, a diverse community and this should be celebrated. Our new citizens should be made to feel welcome for a number of reasons. First Scotland has a serious population shortage, if we do not welcome and assist people who choose to come here then we will have serious problems in the future. It is also the case that children who come here from other countries are very keen to be educated and enjoy school - they have a very positive impact on their scottish pier group. If there are problems in Govanhill, and there are a few, they are about poverty, car filled streets and poor housing stock.
I played on the streets when i was a child, did anyone else? What's wrong with that. If children are at risk from traffic then it's the traffic that's the problem not the children. Govanhill is often described as 'From Bengal to Donegal' because of the mix of people who live there. It's time we all got together and celebrated our different cultures, ideas and way of life.Our youth project is under funded, our swimming pool has been closed down leaving residents with little or nothing to do. Populating the streets is a good thing which actually makes our streets safer. Fights among young people can easily be dealt with if the groups are brought together to share what they have in common and learn about their differences. Some of the contributions here are racist and would fit better on a BNP leaflet which I could then chuck in the nearest skip.
I'm sickened by some of the early comments here. I live in Govanhill and I have to say the shock horror headlines do not represent the facts. For a start Govanhill is, and always has been, a diverse community and this should be celebrated. Our new citizens should be made to feel welcome for a number of reasons. First Scotland has a serious population shortage, if we do not welcome and assist people who choose to come here then we will have serious problems in the future. It is also the case that children who come here from other countries are very keen to be educated and enjoy school - they have a very positive impact on their scottish pier group. If there are problems in Govanhill, and there are a few, they are about poverty, car filled streets and poor housing stock.
I played on the streets when i was a child, did anyone else? What's wrong with that. If children are at risk from traffic then it's the traffic that's the problem not the children. Govanhill is often described as 'From Bengal to Donegal' because of the mix of people who live there. It's time we all got together and celebrated our different cultures, ideas and way of life.Our youth project is under funded, our swimming pool has been closed down leaving residents with little or nothing to do. Populating the streets is a good thing which actually makes our streets safer. Fights among young people can easily be dealt with if the groups are brought together to share what they have in common and learn about their differences. Some of the contributions here are racist and would fit better on a BNP leaflet which I could then chuck in the nearest skip.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 5:37pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Lets be realistic,ever since Europe opened its borders Scotland has become a dumping ground..Eastern Europeans are just doing what asylum seekers have been doing for years & what we Scots are still doing,moving abroad to find a better life & escape the race war bthat is coming..Me personally,im off to Australia in 3weeks,i no longer feel that Scotland is my countr..We are slowly becoming the minority & if you dare say it out loud you are accused by the bleeding heart liberal PC brigade that you are RACIST..
Lets be realistic,ever since Europe opened its borders Scotland has become a dumping ground..Eastern Europeans are just doing what asylum seekers have been doing for years & what we Scots are still doing,moving abroad to find a better life & escape the race war bthat is coming..Me personally,im off to Australia in 3weeks,i no longer feel that Scotland is my countr..We are slowly becoming the minority & if you dare say it out loud you are accused by the bleeding heart liberal PC brigade that you are RACIST..
Posted by: Doug, Cathcart on 5:44pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Rosie, you could not be more right if you tried.
John S, you're not just being racist, you're being incredibly naive and stupid. If you actually researched what you were saying, you would soon see how wrong you were.
"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
I'd be willing to bet that within a couple of generations we will be writing the history of how these people enriched our society.
Or don't you think our "mongrel nation" should have taken in the Irish, the Italians, the Jews and everyone else that we have over the last 2 thousand years?
And how many English people have settled here?
People come here because despite attitudes of a minority, this is a great country, with faults of course. But people come here for a better life and i personally welcome them.
Let us not forget how Scots played their part in settling in countries as diverse as Canada, South Africa and Australia. But again, that is alright isn't it because that is us. Come on!
But we won't mention Darien, or colonialism, because that might put us in a less than flattering light. We are all human beings and as such should try to our best for our fellow people wherever they come from.
Rosie, you could not be more right if you tried.
John S, you're not just being racist, you're being incredibly naive and stupid. If you actually researched what you were saying, you would soon see how wrong you were.
"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
I'd be willing to bet that within a couple of generations we will be writing the history of how these people enriched our society.
Or don't you think our "mongrel nation" should have taken in the Irish, the Italians, the Jews and everyone else that we have over the last 2 thousand years?
And how many English people have settled here?
People come here because despite attitudes of a minority, this is a great country, with faults of course. But people come here for a better life and i personally welcome them.
Let us not forget how Scots played their part in settling in countries as diverse as Canada, South Africa and Australia. But again, that is alright isn't it because that is us. Come on!
But we won't mention Darien, or colonialism, because that might put us in a less than flattering light. We are all human beings and as such should try to our best for our fellow people wherever they come from.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 5:53pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Meanwhile back at the bleeding heart PC liberal brigade...
Des, it's not what is being said. It is the way in which it is said. There is nothing wrong with questioning the expansion of the EU and the effects of economic migration. However, when it's questioned in the form of "these people" and "send them back" then it takes on a different meaning.
Anyway, as you are proving, most migration is economically motivated.
Varoomshka, if you are still around. What kind of work are they doing for these gangmasters?
Meanwhile back at the bleeding heart PC liberal brigade...
Des, it's not what is being said. It is the way in which it is said. There is nothing wrong with questioning the expansion of the EU and the effects of economic migration. However, when it's questioned in the form of "these people" and "send them back" then it takes on a different meaning.
Anyway, as you are proving, most migration is economically motivated.
Varoomshka, if you are still around. What kind of work are they doing for these gangmasters?
Posted by: John, S.side on 6:05pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Doug, who the **** u think u are, dont ever call me a racist or stupid, i have a point of view, i said that these immigrants are doing little benefits for the society, and since ur part of the pc brigade you think labelling me as a racist demonises myself.
am all for people living happily ever after mate, i really am, but when it happens that their is running battles, and it should be noted that this isnt a isolated incident in g.hill, then nobodys living happily.
and to your quote of how i feel about jews and irish and italians moving here thousands of years ago is irrelavant for one simple reason moron, it was a very long time ago. todays problems need addressing, not you bringing up archaic examples.
im sorry my friend but you seriously strike me as person not living in touch with reality...
point being, dont call me a racist or such because of my views.
Doug, who the **** u think u are, dont ever call me a racist or stupid, i have a point of view, i said that these immigrants are doing little benefits for the society, and since ur part of the pc brigade you think labelling me as a racist demonises myself.
am all for people living happily ever after mate, i really am, but when it happens that their is running battles, and it should be noted that this isnt a isolated incident in g.hill, then nobodys living happily.
and to your quote of how i feel about jews and irish and italians moving here thousands of years ago is irrelavant for one simple reason moron, it was a very long time ago. todays problems need addressing, not you bringing up archaic examples.
im sorry my friend but you seriously strike me as person not living in touch with reality...
point being, dont call me a racist or such because of my views.
Posted by: Rosie, Govanhill on 6:06pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Well, Des you should be fine in Oz because there are many Scottish people there. Lets hope the aboriginal community don't feel you are intruding. You could be described as 'these people' or 'resource user'. You are an economic migrant and there's nothing worng with that.
Well, Des you should be fine in Oz because there are many Scottish people there. Lets hope the aboriginal community don't feel you are intruding. You could be described as 'these people' or 'resource user'. You are an economic migrant and there's nothing worng with that.
Posted by: Riz (Eastborn), Govanhill on 6:07pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Rosie and Doug, spot on!
I recently put on an event in Queens park during the SouthSide Carnival, I got all proper authorisation etc for sound systems and so on, however the Police still told us to pack up and leave ... Ive been in Govanhill for over ten years (Origionaly from Leith), I found that Govanhill and Leith were very similar with a diverse mixed popualtion that I think works for the most part.
I will be setting up a Workshop FOR ALL of the local kids in Govanhill, IF I HAVE TO FUND IT MYSELF I WILL! Therefore the racists (even if you dont know you are) cannot complain about what goernment money is being spent on etc, by the way try look at whats being spent on killing people rather than whats helping them live their lives ie Trident etc. Its funny, our government spend over ten times on Killing people than they do on keeping people alive ...what does that tell you?
So if anyone would like to help me set up Music and Sports workshops, I have all the contacts for both but could always do with more, please feel free to email me info@dropzonerecords.com or go to my myspace at myspace.com/eastbornanddjswitch
I look forward to speaking to you all ...
Finally to the dude moving to Australia ... I was on tour there last year, lovely place, you are aware tho that when you go there they will call YOU an immigrant! Shoe on the other foot and all that, but all the best all the same.
Rosie and Doug, spot on!
I recently put on an event in Queens park during the SouthSide Carnival, I got all proper authorisation etc for sound systems and so on, however the Police still told us to pack up and leave ... Ive been in Govanhill for over ten years (Origionaly from Leith), I found that Govanhill and Leith were very similar with a diverse mixed popualtion that I think works for the most part.
I will be setting up a Workshop FOR ALL of the local kids in Govanhill, IF I HAVE TO FUND IT MYSELF I WILL! Therefore the racists (even if you dont know you are) cannot complain about what goernment money is being spent on etc, by the way try look at whats being spent on killing people rather than whats helping them live their lives ie Trident etc. Its funny, our government spend over ten times on Killing people than they do on keeping people alive ...what does that tell you?
So if anyone would like to help me set up Music and Sports workshops, I have all the contacts for both but could always do with more, please feel free to email me info@dropzonerecords.com or go to my myspace at myspace.com/eastbornanddjswitch
I look forward to speaking to you all ...
Finally to the dude moving to Australia ... I was on tour there last year, lovely place, you are aware tho that when you go there they will call YOU an immigrant! Shoe on the other foot and all that, but all the best all the same.
Posted by: bryan, newcastle on 6:14pm Fri 16 Mar 07
[bold]eastern bloc in govan-hill, trouble brewing daily with the local community these local folk never asked for any of the harrasment nightly my heart does go out to the people of govanhill when in it's day was a great area of glasgow to live in .red-sandstone buildings ect...but to finish this problem has to be erradicated and quickly .[/bold]
eastern bloc in govan-hill, trouble brewing daily with the local community these local folk never asked for any of the harrasment nightly my heart does go out to the people of govanhill when in it's day was a great area of glasgow to live in .red-sandstone buildings ect...but to finish this problem has to be erradicated and quickly . Posted by: alex, Glasgow on 6:18pm Fri 16 Mar 07
the comments i would like to place are simple and direct....as a tradesman with qualifications i find it very difficult to find a job and be fairly paid simply because our government is flooding our city with immigrants and creating an opening in the industries for people to be exploited whilst this is happening people like myself suffer when it comes to looking for a job and being paid a FAIR hourly rate!!!!!the system stinks!!!!
the comments i would like to place are simple and direct....as a tradesman with qualifications i find it very difficult to find a job and be fairly paid simply because our government is flooding our city with immigrants and creating an opening in the industries for people to be exploited whilst this is happening people like myself suffer when it comes to looking for a job and being paid a FAIR hourly rate!!!!!the system stinks!!!!
Posted by: Stef, Cathcart on 6:22pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Doug and Rosie seem to be talking the most sense here. How many of us "Glaswegians" or our parents are originally from Scotland? Immigrants come to Scotland looking for a better life and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. Who wouldn't? How many Scottish people moved to Canada, Australia and New Zealand over the past decades to look for a better life and most of these people went with less than the new immigrants who arrive here. Yes, Glasgow has it's economic problems but don't blame these on the new immigrants. The local council receives money from the home office for taking in immigrants but doesn't seem to be spending it wisely enough. I would say though that there are probably social problems in Glasgow such as housing, schooling and transport that need to be addressed before we start taking in more vunerable people.
Doug and Rosie seem to be talking the most sense here. How many of us "Glaswegians" or our parents are originally from Scotland? Immigrants come to Scotland looking for a better life and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. Who wouldn't? How many Scottish people moved to Canada, Australia and New Zealand over the past decades to look for a better life and most of these people went with less than the new immigrants who arrive here. Yes, Glasgow has it's economic problems but don't blame these on the new immigrants. The local council receives money from the home office for taking in immigrants but doesn't seem to be spending it wisely enough. I would say though that there are probably social problems in Glasgow such as housing, schooling and transport that need to be addressed before we start taking in more vunerable people.
Posted by: Rosie, Govanhill on 6:23pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Good stuff Riz, I will email you and would love to help out. have you seen the amazing work that goes on in Govanhill Grove on Bankhall Street? Not much mention of that in the media, yet our local young folk are recycling, being creative and have created an amazing garden in a community where we don't have gardens. Sadly the council want to take this back and build on it - shame!
last year I heard a lot of noise outside my window (I live four up) when i looked out there were a group of Czech men and a group of youths shouting at each other. i had no idea what the Czech men were aying but the young folk were actually shouting "we don't want a fight mate". it's possible the Czech men were saying the same thing. i shouted out to the lads that they should put there arms down and lower their voices. They did this and things calmed down. the police arrived, so I ran down and explained to the police what had happened. it was a misunderstanding and fear. the police were actually ok about it and everyone went home. It's about communication and understanding plus sharing. there is more than enough room in Scotland and as i said earlier if new people do not come here and settel then there will not be enough taxes to make sure Thomas and Des etc have a roof over their heads, hospitals, doctors, social workers and so on.
Check the demographics lads.
Good stuff Riz, I will email you and would love to help out. have you seen the amazing work that goes on in Govanhill Grove on Bankhall Street? Not much mention of that in the media, yet our local young folk are recycling, being creative and have created an amazing garden in a community where we don't have gardens. Sadly the council want to take this back and build on it - shame!
last year I heard a lot of noise outside my window (I live four up) when i looked out there were a group of Czech men and a group of youths shouting at each other. i had no idea what the Czech men were aying but the young folk were actually shouting "we don't want a fight mate". it's possible the Czech men were saying the same thing. i shouted out to the lads that they should put there arms down and lower their voices. They did this and things calmed down. the police arrived, so I ran down and explained to the police what had happened. it was a misunderstanding and fear. the police were actually ok about it and everyone went home. It's about communication and understanding plus sharing. there is more than enough room in Scotland and as i said earlier if new people do not come here and settel then there will not be enough taxes to make sure Thomas and Des etc have a roof over their heads, hospitals, doctors, social workers and so on.
Check the demographics lads.
Posted by: Riz (EASTBORN), Govanhill on 6:24pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Alex...I total see where your coming from and I feel for you BUT, the blame is surely at the hands of th Government then, not the people who are escaping persicution and looking for a better life. See the point?
Alex...I total see where your coming from and I feel for you BUT, the blame is surely at the hands of th Government then, not the people who are escaping persicution and looking for a better life. See the point?
Posted by: Jon Lynda, Glasgow on 6:28pm Fri 16 Mar 07
The Council indicated £15 million for a bridge in the yuppy belt yesterday. Council tax payers in Govanhill are asking questions about their area no nice quote or picture of Mr Purcell getting tough on this one.
The Council indicated £15 million for a bridge in the yuppy belt yesterday. Council tax payers in Govanhill are asking questions about their area no nice quote or picture of Mr Purcell getting tough on this one.
Posted by: Rosie on 6:37pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Alex, Riz is right. there is not reason for a tradesman to find it hard to get work when we need schools, homes, hospitals to be built and repaired. And yes new citizens are being exploited. This also creates unrest between communities and keeps us fighting with each other when we should be getting together and making trade unions, politicians etc do the right thing. call centres etc are where the jobs are now and workers there are getting ripped off too. there is a skills shortage and a population shortage, no question about that. But the governemnts priorities lie with the inetrests of their big business buddies and not with the people they should represent. invetment in public services would ensure you had work and decent pay and ocnditions.
We are always divided by race, colour,creed (this city knows about that) and gender - lets get our heads together and point the finger of blame towards the guilty - our decision makers and their pals.
Alex, Riz is right. there is not reason for a tradesman to find it hard to get work when we need schools, homes, hospitals to be built and repaired. And yes new citizens are being exploited. This also creates unrest between communities and keeps us fighting with each other when we should be getting together and making trade unions, politicians etc do the right thing. call centres etc are where the jobs are now and workers there are getting ripped off too. there is a skills shortage and a population shortage, no question about that. But the governemnts priorities lie with the inetrests of their big business buddies and not with the people they should represent. invetment in public services would ensure you had work and decent pay and ocnditions.
We are always divided by race, colour,creed (this city knows about that) and gender - lets get our heads together and point the finger of blame towards the guilty - our decision makers and their pals.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 6:51pm Fri 16 Mar 07
I am 68 years old.
I have lived in Govanhill all my life.
I have been all around the world with the merchant navy.
Asia, Africa, America, Australia.
I am neither narrow minded nor a racist.
I have never seen a generation of children so ill educated as the current one - both white and brown.
Does no one realise we are just a little part of a new global ecconomy - any idea of national patriotism is being re[placed with the notion of multi-culturalism.
IAny point I am making is really simple.
Anyone who wants to move to this contry on a permanent basis should; (As anyone moving to Australia will know)
1) be offering something the country has a shortage of - a valuable skill. We don't need to import unskilled people we have lots of our own.
2) Have enough money to house feed and support themselves for a couple of years at least.
3) be ready willing and able to become a national at the soonest opportunity. Giving up any other nationality to become a Brittish citizen.
Most EU ecconomic migrants are here for a few years then gone.
I am 68 years old.
I have lived in Govanhill all my life.
I have been all around the world with the merchant navy.
Asia, Africa, America, Australia.
I am neither narrow minded nor a racist.
I have never seen a generation of children so ill educated as the current one - both white and brown.
Does no one realise we are just a little part of a new global ecconomy - any idea of national patriotism is being re[placed with the notion of multi-culturalism.
IAny point I am making is really simple.
Anyone who wants to move to this contry on a permanent basis should; (As anyone moving to Australia will know)
1) be offering something the country has a shortage of - a valuable skill. We don't need to import unskilled people we have lots of our own.
2) Have enough money to house feed and support themselves for a couple of years at least.
3) be ready willing and able to become a national at the soonest opportunity. Giving up any other nationality to become a Brittish citizen.
Most EU ecconomic migrants are here for a few years then gone.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 7:02pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Rosie, Riz, Grant or Doug.
Do you drive?
What would happen to you if you double parked?
Treble parked?
Quadrouble parked?
Blocked an entire residential street for an afternoon?
Every Friday my friend is trapped by over 100 cars that suddenly appear - and block his car into his street - as described.
No police action.
Multi-culturalism means that even the police are afraid to impose a sensible rule os law.
Rosie, Riz, Grant or Doug.
Do you drive?
What would happen to you if you double parked?
Treble parked?
Quadrouble parked?
Blocked an entire residential street for an afternoon?
Every Friday my friend is trapped by over 100 cars that suddenly appear - and block his car into his street - as described.
No police action.
Multi-culturalism means that even the police are afraid to impose a sensible rule os law.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 7:05pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Rosie im moving because of whats happening to this country,politicians are lying to us,socialists want to run Scotland(they are a joke)& i am treated as a second class citizen in my own country..As for being an economic migrant im not,i have more than enough money to never work again,money which i work damned hard for..I am starting a business in Australia with the intention of employing mostly indigenous four of which i have in place already,so stick that in your socialist pipe & smoke..One thing i will be glad to leave behind is non entities like the socialist party who stage meaningless protests costing the tax payer money that could be better spent.........
Rosie im moving because of whats happening to this country,politicians are lying to us,socialists want to run Scotland(they are a joke)& i am treated as a second class citizen in my own country..As for being an economic migrant im not,i have more than enough money to never work again,money which i work damned hard for..I am starting a business in Australia with the intention of employing mostly indigenous four of which i have in place already,so stick that in your socialist pipe & smoke..One thing i will be glad to leave behind is non entities like the socialist party who stage meaningless protests costing the tax payer money that could be better spent.........
Posted by: Rosie, Govanhill on 7:12pm Fri 16 Mar 07
But Thomas we have a population shortage which will have a very negative effect on future generations. We need people who will have babies - it's a simple as that. Children are not getting a good enough education, your right, and this is effecting their confidence and ability. Class sizes are too high and teachers are not motivated as a result of the pressures put on them. Our schools are being closed down and amalgamated and this has an effect on perfomance.
The lines that are drawn accross the world - known as borders - are man made and much of that was carried out by spilling blood and exploiting people. Our past governments and rulers have that blood on their hands.Slavery, exploitation, land grabs, oil, destruction of rain forrests, stealing resources etc etc. Our history is not good and we must take responsibility for that by not forgetting it.Our governments and big business have caused wars, famines and destruction which has mispalced and uprooted people - it's time we did something good and offered shelter and support. in return we will get people, children and a future
I don't see why people should give up their culture and background to live here - we don't do it when we go abroad. Of course folk should learn English, this allows them to intergrate, learn and work and most people are desperate to do just that.
My father was Irish when he came here with his accent and red hair he put up with a lot of abuse. he was a labourer and slogged his guts out for very little reward. he never gave up his background. He married my mother and had five children, we all grew up here and have contributed well in taxes, skills, community etc. Thats not a bad cycle and we can still nip over to ireland and visit the family.
Come on folks - have a heart. When there is a problem lets find a solution that does not involve attacking a whole section of society.
But Thomas we have a population shortage which will have a very negative effect on future generations. We need people who will have babies - it's a simple as that. Children are not getting a good enough education, your right, and this is effecting their confidence and ability. Class sizes are too high and teachers are not motivated as a result of the pressures put on them. Our schools are being closed down and amalgamated and this has an effect on perfomance.
The lines that are drawn accross the world - known as borders - are man made and much of that was carried out by spilling blood and exploiting people. Our past governments and rulers have that blood on their hands.Slavery, exploitation, land grabs, oil, destruction of rain forrests, stealing resources etc etc. Our history is not good and we must take responsibility for that by not forgetting it.Our governments and big business have caused wars, famines and destruction which has mispalced and uprooted people - it's time we did something good and offered shelter and support. in return we will get people, children and a future
I don't see why people should give up their culture and background to live here - we don't do it when we go abroad. Of course folk should learn English, this allows them to intergrate, learn and work and most people are desperate to do just that.
My father was Irish when he came here with his accent and red hair he put up with a lot of abuse. he was a labourer and slogged his guts out for very little reward. he never gave up his background. He married my mother and had five children, we all grew up here and have contributed well in taxes, skills, community etc. Thats not a bad cycle and we can still nip over to ireland and visit the family.
Come on folks - have a heart. When there is a problem lets find a solution that does not involve attacking a whole section of society.
Posted by: Des on 7:27pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Thomas i would love to stay here but the standard of living is getting worse,schools are a joke,my kids education is suffering because of the influx of non English speaking kids..The teacher has to spend more time with them & that affects the learning of other children...Our Nurses & Doctors who do a great job are treated dreadfully by the joke that is the Scottish Parliament..When i go to Australia i will embrace the country & its customs 100%,i will endeavour to fit in..I love my country but my country does not love me,it loves the huge amount of tax i pay every year for which i get very little in return........
Thomas i would love to stay here but the standard of living is getting worse,schools are a joke,my kids education is suffering because of the influx of non English speaking kids..The teacher has to spend more time with them & that affects the learning of other children...Our Nurses & Doctors who do a great job are treated dreadfully by the joke that is the Scottish Parliament..When i go to Australia i will embrace the country & its customs 100%,i will endeavour to fit in..I love my country but my country does not love me,it loves the huge amount of tax i pay every year for which i get very little in return........
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 7:32pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Scotland does not - I repeat DOES NOT HAVE A POPULATION SHORTAGE.
That myth was pretty thoroughly dismissed by the Scottish Parliament in January http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/6243075.stm
What Scotland does have is an ageing population - old duffers like me.
People who received a wold class education (the finest in the world).
Why is that no longer the case?
Rosie you are so nieve!
Your red haired Irish Father was from a different tribe of the same race - it is in the nature of people to clan together and resist the outsider.
It is by what the outsider offers the society that determines what success they have as an immigrant.
The Irish have been coming and going from Scotland for thousands of years. Of course large scale immigration is resisted by the host population because it changes that host population FOREVER!!!
I am not in a minority - the vast majority of the white population - are fed up to the back teeth with this forced move to being a multi-cultural society.
I am not a member of a multi-cultural society I am a Scot living in Scotland.
You should do a Google search on what Trevor Philips (a prominent black political figure) - the entire notion of multi-cultural is well and truly out the window.
As usual trendy "socialist worker" types are so far behind the time it is amusing listening to you.
Yes you and Riz have a musical afternoon in Govanhill park - that will solve all the problems.
Scotland does not - I repeat DOES NOT HAVE A POPULATION SHORTAGE.
That myth was pretty thoroughly dismissed by the Scottish Parliament in January http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/6243075.stm
What Scotland does have is an ageing population - old duffers like me.
People who received a wold class education (the finest in the world).
Why is that no longer the case?
Rosie you are so nieve!
Your red haired Irish Father was from a different tribe of the same race - it is in the nature of people to clan together and resist the outsider.
It is by what the outsider offers the society that determines what success they have as an immigrant.
The Irish have been coming and going from Scotland for thousands of years. Of course large scale immigration is resisted by the host population because it changes that host population FOREVER!!!
I am not in a minority - the vast majority of the white population - are fed up to the back teeth with this forced move to being a multi-cultural society.
I am not a member of a multi-cultural society I am a Scot living in Scotland.
You should do a Google search on what Trevor Philips (a prominent black political figure) - the entire notion of multi-cultural is well and truly out the window.
As usual trendy "socialist worker" types are so far behind the time it is amusing listening to you.
Yes you and Riz have a musical afternoon in Govanhill park - that will solve all the problems.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 7:43pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Des.
I wish every success in the world.
You are the latest in a very long line of people from this very tint country who have done a vast ammount for the countries they immigrate to.
Yes it is a loss to lose valuable Scots. You are right- the country you grew up in is being sold from under your very feet.
I don't blame anyone for looking for a better life.
I just wish Scotland was being run better - and we chose the best in the world to come here. Regardless of colour. Peple who wanted to become Scots.
Des.
I wish every success in the world.
You are the latest in a very long line of people from this very tint country who have done a vast ammount for the countries they immigrate to.
Yes it is a loss to lose valuable Scots. You are right- the country you grew up in is being sold from under your very feet.
I don't blame anyone for looking for a better life.
I just wish Scotland was being run better - and we chose the best in the world to come here. Regardless of colour. Peple who wanted to become Scots.
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 7:45pm Fri 16 Mar 07
There has been a flood of [bold]legal[/bold] immigration into this country from former Eastern Bloc countries, far more than was expected:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6234011.stm
I seem to remember that the Slovakian government paid it's gypsies £400 each to go elsewhere, apparently quite a few of them landed at Glasgow.
It does seem that we are having to accomodate the displaced peasantry of the poorer European countries.
If you want to blame anything, blame the EU and it's rush to enlargement.
As to what to do? Well, we can't [italic]forcibly[/italic] send them back. So, either way pay them to go back or we educate them in our way of life (through schools, churches, social services). Doing nothing will only make things worse.
There has been a flood of
legal immigration into this country from former Eastern Bloc countries, far more than was expected:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6234011.stm
I seem to remember that the Slovakian government paid it's gypsies £400 each to go elsewhere, apparently quite a few of them landed at Glasgow.
It does seem that we are having to accomodate the displaced peasantry of the poorer European countries.
If you want to blame anything, blame the EU and it's rush to enlargement.
As to what to do? Well, we can't
forcibly send them back. So, either way pay them to go back or we educate them in our way of life (through schools, churches, social services). Doing nothing will only make things worse.
Posted by: colin, Glasgow on 7:49pm Fri 16 Mar 07
[bold]bold[/bold] [bold]bold[/bold] Thomas the 68 year old i couldn't put it any better myself
Thomas the 68 year old i couldn't put it any better myself
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 7:50pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Mary
These are Gypsies.
They have a way of life of their own - a very old traditional way of life that no number of social workers will change.
They are quite happy the way they are.
If you are right and Slovakian govenment paid them to go (and they are a very modern enlightened country) they knew that they were more trouble than they were worth.
What I don't understand is why do we have them?
I would pay them to go elsewhere and change the law to not let them back in.
Mary
These are Gypsies.
They have a way of life of their own - a very old traditional way of life that no number of social workers will change.
They are quite happy the way they are.
If you are right and Slovakian govenment paid them to go (and they are a very modern enlightened country) they knew that they were more trouble than they were worth.
What I don't understand is why do we have them?
I would pay them to go elsewhere and change the law to not let them back in.
Posted by: Jim, Barcelona on 8:00pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Being an ex resident of the area and having lived here in barcelona for two years I have a somewhat different perspective on this. Arriving in any city, and handicapped by an inability to speak the language is a very daunting prospect.
Ally that to the fact that the area had pre existing difficulties in terms of poverty then you have a recipe for problems.
The sloution is support. I was able to take very cheap lessons in Spanish and there were people around who kept us right. The value of such support cannot be underestimated
Being an ex resident of the area and having lived here in barcelona for two years I have a somewhat different perspective on this. Arriving in any city, and handicapped by an inability to speak the language is a very daunting prospect.
Ally that to the fact that the area had pre existing difficulties in terms of poverty then you have a recipe for problems.
The sloution is support. I was able to take very cheap lessons in Spanish and there were people around who kept us right. The value of such support cannot be underestimated
Posted by: colin, glasgow on 8:02pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Thomas you are a very well educated man as well as far travelled in your life it's great that even a man of your age is very much in touch with relevant issues in our communities and not out of touch like some who have posted here for the record i'm only 39
Thomas you are a very well educated man as well as far travelled in your life it's great that even a man of your age is very much in touch with relevant issues in our communities and not out of touch like some who have posted here for the record i'm only 39
Posted by: MikeCraig@hotmail.co.uk, Glasgow on 8:04pm Fri 16 Mar 07
There is something I dont quite get.
What do we owe these people? Can someone explain that? Were the social workers running after them with fruit and flowers? What have they or will they do for us?
I bet these people get more from social services and the council and so on than the Scottish people.
Frankly, its vomit inducing.
Legal immigrants? Aye, and how many illegals? How many asylum seekers? What do they do for wages and conditons of work. Aye, push them down.
Its easy defending theses people. Aye, if you dont live beside them.
Gypsies? So will they ever work? I doubt it. BUT we are to pay them benefits and take care of them as per the NHS. What is this influx doing for waiting lists?
Population shortage? So we let gypsies in like? Eh?
What about the schools in these areas? They must be truly abysmal. What chance has your wean got going to them. The do gooder social work type dont send their kids to them.
These people will never work. And who r they anyway? Criminals? Rapists? How do we know who they are and what they done in the past?
And again, what do we owe them? What will they ever give us or our society?
There is something I dont quite get.
What do we owe these people? Can someone explain that? Were the social workers running after them with fruit and flowers? What have they or will they do for us?
I bet these people get more from social services and the council and so on than the Scottish people.
Frankly, its vomit inducing.
Legal immigrants? Aye, and how many illegals? How many asylum seekers? What do they do for wages and conditons of work. Aye, push them down.
Its easy defending theses people. Aye, if you dont live beside them.
Gypsies? So will they ever work? I doubt it. BUT we are to pay them benefits and take care of them as per the NHS. What is this influx doing for waiting lists?
Population shortage? So we let gypsies in like? Eh?
What about the schools in these areas? They must be truly abysmal. What chance has your wean got going to them. The do gooder social work type dont send their kids to them.
These people will never work. And who r they anyway? Criminals? Rapists? How do we know who they are and what they done in the past?
And again, what do we owe them? What will they ever give us or our society?
Posted by: Mike Craig, glasgow on 8:08pm Fri 16 Mar 07
A final point, the social work type who say we should welcome them and so on dont live anywhere near them eh?
And they are not the ones who have to wait far longer for Doctors appointments and so on. They are not the ones with abysmal schools.
It really is beyond belief.
Basically, the middle class sort are forcing the like of gypsie onto the poorer Scots. That IS the case. And it is the Scots in the unskilled jobs who are paying a very high price.
A final point, the social work type who say we should welcome them and so on dont live anywhere near them eh?
And they are not the ones who have to wait far longer for Doctors appointments and so on. They are not the ones with abysmal schools.
It really is beyond belief.
Basically, the middle class sort are forcing the like of gypsie onto the poorer Scots. That IS the case. And it is the Scots in the unskilled jobs who are paying a very high price.
Posted by: Craig, glasgow on 8:11pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Immigrants and so on are hardly to be found in the wee villages. They are being concentrated in ghetto land. And the middle classes know it. Our social system will go on fire shortly. It really will. Riots and so on are not far off. Do the middle class think that ordinary working class Scots will keep taking it like? Crazy - they wont.
Immigrants and so on are hardly to be found in the wee villages. They are being concentrated in ghetto land. And the middle classes know it. Our social system will go on fire shortly. It really will. Riots and so on are not far off. Do the middle class think that ordinary working class Scots will keep taking it like? Crazy - they wont.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:16pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Colin - the point I was making about my age and education is that in my day EVERYONE had a great education. Whay don'y they now. Bewcause what would society do with a well educated population.
The powers that be would much prefer to see a scheme full of neds.
Remember NED stands fr Non Educated Delinquent.
Mike - I'm not sure they have to be rapists. They are simply unsuitable for the growth of a 21st century counrty. I have met dozens of people from Eastern Europe in Govanhill who are first rate individuals with drive and ambition. The problem for us is that they are just passing through. Here for a while to make some money (and why not).
They do have an unintentional effect of pushing down the wages of Scottish tradesmen - not their fault but it happens all the same.
Colin - the point I was making about my age and education is that in my day EVERYONE had a great education. Whay don'y they now. Bewcause what would society do with a well educated population.
The powers that be would much prefer to see a scheme full of neds.
Remember NED stands fr Non Educated Delinquent.
Mike - I'm not sure they have to be rapists. They are simply unsuitable for the growth of a 21st century counrty. I have met dozens of people from Eastern Europe in Govanhill who are first rate individuals with drive and ambition. The problem for us is that they are just passing through. Here for a while to make some money (and why not).
They do have an unintentional effect of pushing down the wages of Scottish tradesmen - not their fault but it happens all the same.
Posted by: J, tbank on 8:17pm Fri 16 Mar 07
These lads craig and mike have got it spot, all these panzy posts who say, 'ohh we should love and welcome them' yous dont live near these ppl and see the damage.
These lads craig and mike have got it spot, all these panzy posts who say, 'ohh we should love and welcome them' yous dont live near these ppl and see the damage.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:32pm Fri 16 Mar 07
J. tbank - yes indeed Rosie and the rest of the rose tinted squad did shoot themselves in the foot a bit.
Slovakia doesn't want them - pays them to leave - but they are good enough for the future of Scotland.
The mind boggles.
J. tbank - yes indeed Rosie and the rest of the rose tinted squad did shoot themselves in the foot a bit.
Slovakia doesn't want them - pays them to leave - but they are good enough for the future of Scotland.
The mind boggles.
Posted by: AL, South Side on 8:34pm Fri 16 Mar 07
How the **** did we ever get into this mindset?
As a Glaswegian I am happy to welcome to our city all races, creeds and nationalities. All I ask is that these immigrants obey the law. If they do not then they are not welcome.
It is reported that gangs of youths battled with each other for an hour.Now you would think that the police would enforce the law and stop this kind of thing immediately; but aparently alas not. Never mind about community police officers and the like. Just ensure that the police do what they are paid to do with a greater deal of expediency.
Regarding housing if it is worse than that in the country of their origin why did they come? If it is better, albeit poor, then they have improved their lot.
Why do we feel that we owe these people a living? We do certainly not, but we do owe them a welcome and an opportunity to improve their lives. What they make of it is up to them. They should not be led but only encouraged to integrate, which is not to say they sould not retain their own native culture, and if they fail to seize the oportunity they are of no worth to this city and probably of no worth to themselves.
How the **** did we ever get into this mindset?
As a Glaswegian I am happy to welcome to our city all races, creeds and nationalities. All I ask is that these immigrants obey the law. If they do not then they are not welcome.
It is reported that gangs of youths battled with each other for an hour.Now you would think that the police would enforce the law and stop this kind of thing immediately; but aparently alas not. Never mind about community police officers and the like. Just ensure that the police do what they are paid to do with a greater deal of expediency.
Regarding housing if it is worse than that in the country of their origin why did they come? If it is better, albeit poor, then they have improved their lot.
Why do we feel that we owe these people a living? We do certainly not, but we do owe them a welcome and an opportunity to improve their lives. What they make of it is up to them. They should not be led but only encouraged to integrate, which is not to say they sould not retain their own native culture, and if they fail to seize the oportunity they are of no worth to this city and probably of no worth to themselves.
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 8:34pm Fri 16 Mar 07
In an attempt to provide some evidence for what I said above:
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
I'm still looking for evidence of the cash payment though.
In an attempt to provide some evidence for what I said above:
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
I'm still looking for evidence of the cash payment though.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:48pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Great link Mary - thanks.
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
So the logic from the Slovakian PM is that these people are only intended as "cheap labour". Disgraceful.
What a way to treat people.
Can anyone tell me am I a racist because I doubt the worth of importing people who speak no English, have no skills and are from a culture that will be VERY highly resistant to integration?
Great link Mary - thanks.
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
So the logic from the Slovakian PM is that these people are only intended as "cheap labour". Disgraceful.
What a way to treat people.
Can anyone tell me am I a racist because I doubt the worth of importing people who speak no English, have no skills and are from a culture that will be VERY highly resistant to integration?
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 9:04pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Here is an interesting speech by Trevor Philips the head of the Commision for racial equality -
He seems to be saying that "multi-culturalism" as a concept leads us to sleepwalk into racial segregation.
Well worth reading.
http://www.rima.org.uk/Default.aspx.LocID-0hgnew0jl.RefLocID-0hg00900c002.Lang-EN.htm
Trevor Philips seems to agree with a lot of what Mike Craig was saying earlier in this discussion - but no doubt many of you reading what he said would think him racist.
Hmm - interesting.
Here is an interesting speech by Trevor Philips the head of the Commision for racial equality -
He seems to be saying that "multi-culturalism" as a concept leads us to sleepwalk into racial segregation.
Well worth reading.
http://www.rima.org.uk/Default.aspx.LocID-0hgnew0jl.RefLocID-0hg00900c002.Lang-EN.htm
Trevor Philips seems to agree with a lot of what Mike Craig was saying earlier in this discussion - but no doubt many of you reading what he said would think him racist.
Hmm - interesting.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 9:15pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Thanks Thomas for your good wishes,like yourself i dont care what colour or creed people are,as long as they can contribute to the country then great they are very welcome..To say we should open our arms to all is wrong,the politicians & social workers with their rose tinted specs do not have to live in the areas where they settle..As for a population shortage,another myth put about by two homes McConnell & his cronies who spend our tax dollars on trips to Malawi ,charity begins at home people though our so called leaders seem to forget that......
Thanks Thomas for your good wishes,like yourself i dont care what colour or creed people are,as long as they can contribute to the country then great they are very welcome..To say we should open our arms to all is wrong,the politicians & social workers with their rose tinted specs do not have to live in the areas where they settle..As for a population shortage,another myth put about by two homes McConnell & his cronies who spend our tax dollars on trips to Malawi ,charity begins at home people though our so called leaders seem to forget that......
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 9:52pm Fri 16 Mar 07
AL aksed earlier why the police don't do more.
I think I have the answer.
It would cast too much!
Scotland’s police forces are struggling to maintain budgets as it is revealed they are spending more cash than ever on interpreters for foreign suspects and witnesses.
At least £256,000 was spent in 2005-06 on translators - a leap of 43 per cent on two years ago. Only Strathclyde Police saw a fall - but they still spent just less than £70,000, using interpreters 1481 times. Tayside's expenditure rose the most in the two-year period, almost quadrupling from £12,785 to £44,491. Grampian's soared nearly three-fold from £13,500 to £37,695.
And Dumfries and Galloway also saw a large jump, from £2525 to more than £14,000.
Lothian and Borders spent £62,847, up from £45,506. Central Scotland's bill was £17,929, up from £10,935. And Northern Constabulary spent £9439, up from £8231. Fife has a budget of £18,000 for interpreters.
Forces have a legal duty to provide interpreters when foreigners who cannot speak English are arrested and charged, need to provide a witness statement or have to take part in identity parades.
A spokesman for the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland said that translators were an "absolute necessity".
He said: "If someone doesn't speak English and they are accused it is vital for the rule of law to find out what they are saying."
AL aksed earlier why the police don't do more.
I think I have the answer.
It would cast too much!
Scotland’s police forces are struggling to maintain budgets as it is revealed they are spending more cash than ever on interpreters for foreign suspects and witnesses.
At least £256,000 was spent in 2005-06 on translators - a leap of 43 per cent on two years ago. Only Strathclyde Police saw a fall - but they still spent just less than £70,000, using interpreters 1481 times. Tayside's expenditure rose the most in the two-year period, almost quadrupling from £12,785 to £44,491. Grampian's soared nearly three-fold from £13,500 to £37,695.
And Dumfries and Galloway also saw a large jump, from £2525 to more than £14,000.
Lothian and Borders spent £62,847, up from £45,506. Central Scotland's bill was £17,929, up from £10,935. And Northern Constabulary spent £9439, up from £8231. Fife has a budget of £18,000 for interpreters.
Forces have a legal duty to provide interpreters when foreigners who cannot speak English are arrested and charged, need to provide a witness statement or have to take part in identity parades.
A spokesman for the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland said that translators were an "absolute necessity".
He said: "If someone doesn't speak English and they are accused it is vital for the rule of law to find out what they are saying."
Posted by: Des on 9:58pm Fri 16 Mar 07
RIZ,firstly i am not an economic migrant,i am setting up business in Australia without any finding from the Australian Govt..I am employing the indigenous people & paying them a decent wage with full benefits..I worked hard for my money & i could retire if i so wished but i dont as i believe in the work ethic..I have contributed a lot to this country & i am taxed heavily for earning good money,i am sick of seeing my tax dollars funding the lifestyles of Jack & his cronies through in Edinburgh..As for being a racist,i resent that accusation,if loving your country & its customs make you a racist then its a sad day ..Its time you took off your liberal,rose tinted specs before its to late..This country of ours will not be ours much longer if Europe & Jack have anything to do with it.....
RIZ,firstly i am not an economic migrant,i am setting up business in Australia without any finding from the Australian Govt..I am employing the indigenous people & paying them a decent wage with full benefits..I worked hard for my money & i could retire if i so wished but i dont as i believe in the work ethic..I have contributed a lot to this country & i am taxed heavily for earning good money,i am sick of seeing my tax dollars funding the lifestyles of Jack & his cronies through in Edinburgh..As for being a racist,i resent that accusation,if loving your country & its customs make you a racist then its a sad day ..Its time you took off your liberal,rose tinted specs before its to late..This country of ours will not be ours much longer if Europe & Jack have anything to do with it.....
Posted by: Kenny S, Dennistoun on 10:07pm Fri 16 Mar 07
It's time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education.
It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.
It's time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education.
It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.
Posted by: Robert, Glasgow on 10:25pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Kenny S dixit: [italic]"It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd."[/italic]
Don't forget to take your medication...
Kenny S dixit:
"It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd."
Don't forget to take your medication...
Posted by: Slog on 10:33pm Fri 16 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Rosie[/bold] wrote:
I\\\'m sickened by some of the early comments here. I live in Govanhill and I have to say the shock horror headlines do not represent the facts. For a start Govanhill is, and always has been, a diverse community and this should be celebrated. Our new citizens should be made to feel welcome for a number of reasons. First Scotland has a serious population shortage, if we do not welcome and assist people who choose to come here then we will have serious problems in the future. It is also the case that children who come here from other countries are very keen to be educated and enjoy school - they have a very positive impact on their scottish pier group. If there are problems in Govanhill, and there are a few, they are about poverty, car filled streets and poor housing stock. I played on the streets when i was a child, did anyone else? What\\\'s wrong with that. If children are at risk from traffic then it\\\'s the traffic that\\\'s the problem not the children. Govanhill is often described as \\\'From Bengal to Donegal\\\' because of the mix of people who live there. It\\\'s time we all got together and celebrated our different cultures, ideas and way of life.Our youth project is under funded, our swimming pool has been closed down leaving residents with little or nothing to do. Populating the streets is a good thing which actually makes our streets safer. Fights among young people can easily be dealt with if the groups are brought together to share what they have in common and learn about their differences. Some of the contributions here are racist and would fit better on a BNP leaflet which I could then chuck in the nearest skip. [/quote] Rosie,do you really think that it is all right for kids to get knocked down?The street is populated with young boys that make rude and sexual remarks to girls passing by,my daughter and friends will not go near where they stand around because they feel unsafe on the streets.They are our guests,but they must make an effort themselves.
Rosie wrote:
I'm sickened by some of the early comments here. I live in Govanhill and I have to say the shock horror headlines do not represent the facts. For a start Govanhill is, and always has been, a diverse community and this should be celebrated. Our new citizens should be made to feel welcome for a number of reasons. First Scotland has a serious population shortage, if we do not welcome and assist people who choose to come here then we will have serious problems in the future. It is also the case that children who come here from other countries are very keen to be educated and enjoy school - they have a very positive impact on their scottish pier group. If there are problems in Govanhill, and there are a few, they are about poverty, car filled streets and poor housing stock. I played on the streets when i was a child, did anyone else? What's wrong with that. If children are at risk from traffic then it's the traffic that's the problem not the children. Govanhill is often described as 'From Bengal to Donegal' because of the mix of people who live there. It's time we all got together and celebrated our different cultures, ideas and way of life.Our youth project is under funded, our swimming pool has been closed down leaving residents with little or nothing to do. Populating the streets is a good thing which actually makes our streets safer. Fights among young people can easily be dealt with if the groups are brought together to share what they have in common and learn about their differences. Some of the contributions here are racist and would fit better on a BNP leaflet which I could then chuck in the nearest skip.
Rosie,do you really think that it is all right for kids to get knocked down?The street is populated with young boys that make rude and sexual remarks to girls passing by,my daughter and friends will not go near where they stand around because they feel unsafe on the streets.They are our guests,but they must make an effort themselves.
Posted by: monk, south lanarkshire on 10:54pm Fri 16 Mar 07
day in day out we all hear the same old slosh about how the new imigrants enrich our lives and culture how exactly?all the problems these people bring are not our issues.the goverments a joke and anyone can see how the imigration policys are beyond belief.keep talking about lovely scotland it will soon be a distant memory the way things are going!!!!!
day in day out we all hear the same old slosh about how the new imigrants enrich our lives and culture how exactly?all the problems these people bring are not our issues.the goverments a joke and anyone can see how the imigration policys are beyond belief.keep talking about lovely scotland it will soon be a distant memory the way things are going!!!!!
Posted by: Allan, Langside on 10:58pm Fri 16 Mar 07
The mono-culturist experiment didn't work for Hitler or Pol Pot so why should it work for Britian which has been multi-cultural since the cavemen? Who are these people amongst trying to force mono-culturism on Scotland and any given excuse? Perhaps they are more anti-Scottish than some of the immigrants they are demonising?
The mono-culturist experiment didn't work for Hitler or Pol Pot so why should it work for Britian which has been multi-cultural since the cavemen? Who are these people amongst trying to force mono-culturism on Scotland and any given excuse? Perhaps they are more anti-Scottish than some of the immigrants they are demonising?
Posted by: LS, Glasgow on 11:03pm Fri 16 Mar 07
Read this article with interest. Used to live in Govanhill and some of my earliest memories are of the large asian popualation - and how different and alien they seemed.
The biggest problem here is intergration - any immigrant has to make that intergration to be any part of the society they intend to live in.
My personal experience of asians in Govanhill is how hostile they are towards the rest of the population - and now it has shown up again.
Its not ideal to have the eastern europeans in teh situation tehy are in just now - but it was the same for asians 30 - 40 years ago - poverty, over crowding, illegal immmigration - its just another cycle again now.
Given time i think the eastern europeans will intergrate and play their own parts, and be a lot more involved in Scotland, possibly more than asians ever will.
Its only a few years since europe opened up so theres still a long way to go before we see how things pan out - a lot want to return home if there are better conditions in their home country and I think that has a chance of happening
Read this article with interest. Used to live in Govanhill and some of my earliest memories are of the large asian popualation - and how different and alien they seemed.
The biggest problem here is intergration - any immigrant has to make that intergration to be any part of the society they intend to live in.
My personal experience of asians in Govanhill is how hostile they are towards the rest of the population - and now it has shown up again.
Its not ideal to have the eastern europeans in teh situation tehy are in just now - but it was the same for asians 30 - 40 years ago - poverty, over crowding, illegal immmigration - its just another cycle again now.
Given time i think the eastern europeans will intergrate and play their own parts, and be a lot more involved in Scotland, possibly more than asians ever will.
Its only a few years since europe opened up so theres still a long way to go before we see how things pan out - a lot want to return home if there are better conditions in their home country and I think that has a chance of happening
Posted by: monk, south lanarkshire on 11:04pm Fri 16 Mar 07
allan your scary beem youself back up pal![bold]bold[/bold]
allan your scary beem youself back up pal!
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 11:10pm Fri 16 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Allan[/bold] wrote:
The mono-culturist experiment didn't work for Hitler or Pol Pot so why should it work for Britian which has been multi-cultural since the cavemen? Who are these people amongst trying to force mono-culturism on Scotland and any given excuse? Perhaps they are more anti-Scottish than some of the immigrants they are demonising?[/quote] Hmm - so anyone that criticises multi-culturalism is Hitler?
Better tell Trevor Philips the chairman of the Commision For Racial Equality.
http://www.rima.org.uk/Default.aspx.LocID-0hgnew0jl.RefLocID-0hg00900c002.Lang-EN.htm
Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
Allan wrote:
The mono-culturist experiment didn't work for Hitler or Pol Pot so why should it work for Britian which has been multi-cultural since the cavemen? Who are these people amongst trying to force mono-culturism on Scotland and any given excuse? Perhaps they are more anti-Scottish than some of the immigrants they are demonising?
Hmm - so anyone that criticises multi-culturalism is Hitler?
Better tell Trevor Philips the chairman of the Commision For Racial Equality.
http://www.rima.org.uk/Default.aspx.LocID-0hgnew0jl.RefLocID-0hg00900c002.Lang-EN.htm
Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 11:30pm Fri 16 Mar 07
[quote][bold]LS[/bold] wrote:
Read this article with interest. Used to live in Govanhill and some of my earliest memories are of the large asian popualation - and how different and alien they seemed.
The biggest problem here is intergration - any immigrant has to make that intergration to be any part of the society they intend to live in.
My personal experience of asians in Govanhill is how hostile they are towards the rest of the population - and now it has shown up again.
Its not ideal to have the eastern europeans in teh situation tehy are in just now - but it was the same for asians 30 - 40 years ago - poverty, over crowding, illegal immmigration - its just another cycle again now.
Given time i think the eastern europeans will intergrate and play their own parts, and be a lot more involved in Scotland, possibly more than asians ever will.
Its only a few years since europe opened up so theres still a long way to go before we see how things pan out - a lot want to return home if there are better conditions in their home country and I think that has a chance of happening[/quote] The problems current are not being caused by Eastern Europeans - on the whole they are urban, intelligent and hard working people - of wit and great worth. People who if they chose to live here on a permanent basis would indeed enrich Scotland and have Scotish children (with interesting permutations). We are discussing a group of Gypsies from Slovakia who were paid by the Slovakian state to leave!
They have a very old traditional culture and have resisted the best attempts of the Eastern bloc to conform - what chance does Glasgow city council have if Stalin failed?
LS wrote:
Read this article with interest. Used to live in Govanhill and some of my earliest memories are of the large asian popualation - and how different and alien they seemed.
The biggest problem here is intergration - any immigrant has to make that intergration to be any part of the society they intend to live in.
My personal experience of asians in Govanhill is how hostile they are towards the rest of the population - and now it has shown up again.
Its not ideal to have the eastern europeans in teh situation tehy are in just now - but it was the same for asians 30 - 40 years ago - poverty, over crowding, illegal immmigration - its just another cycle again now.
Given time i think the eastern europeans will intergrate and play their own parts, and be a lot more involved in Scotland, possibly more than asians ever will.
Its only a few years since europe opened up so theres still a long way to go before we see how things pan out - a lot want to return home if there are better conditions in their home country and I think that has a chance of happening
The problems current are not being caused by Eastern Europeans - on the whole they are urban, intelligent and hard working people - of wit and great worth. People who if they chose to live here on a permanent basis would indeed enrich Scotland and have Scotish children (with interesting permutations). We are discussing a group of Gypsies from Slovakia who were paid by the Slovakian state to leave!
They have a very old traditional culture and have resisted the best attempts of the Eastern bloc to conform - what chance does Glasgow city council have if Stalin failed?
Posted by: Caledonian, Glasgow on 12:04am Sat 17 Mar 07
In 1999, Glasgow District Council did a deal with the Home Office to accommodate thousands of asylum seekers in Glasgow for an initial payment of circa one hundred and twenty million pounds (sic) of British taxpayers’ money. Since then another similar financial deal has been made. The free movement of European labour has brought thousands of job seeking Europeans to Glasgow. We have a large, ever growing serious problem.
Of the 5388 asylum seekers in Glasgow, approximately 75% of these who have had their final legal hearings and decisions taken that they have no right to be here are refusing to leave Britain and ‘disappearing’.
Glasgow District Council were responsible for inflicting this dilemma on Glasgow. They must work with the Home Office to swiftly remove the thousands of failed asylum seekers from this city. The situation is explosive. Action must be taken to deport and reduce the numbers of incomers to Glasgow. Glasgow District Council created the problem - time to stop hiding - time to get involved and start working.
In 1999, Glasgow District Council did a deal with the Home Office to accommodate thousands of asylum seekers in Glasgow for an initial payment of circa one hundred and twenty million pounds (sic) of British taxpayers’ money. Since then another similar financial deal has been made. The free movement of European labour has brought thousands of job seeking Europeans to Glasgow. We have a large, ever growing serious problem.
Of the 5388 asylum seekers in Glasgow, approximately 75% of these who have had their final legal hearings and decisions taken that they have no right to be here are refusing to leave Britain and ‘disappearing’.
Glasgow District Council were responsible for inflicting this dilemma on Glasgow. They must work with the Home Office to swiftly remove the thousands of failed asylum seekers from this city. The situation is explosive. Action must be taken to deport and reduce the numbers of incomers to Glasgow. Glasgow District Council created the problem - time to stop hiding - time to get involved and start working.
Posted by: Fidelio, Gold Coast, Australia on 12:36am Sat 17 Mar 07
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 12:50am Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Fidelio[/bold] wrote:
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.[/quote] Can you be specific - what comments are racist? What attitudes are poisonous?
Of course Australia has an open door policy to economic migrants (oh wait a minute it doesn't does it - it expects immigrantts to fend for themselves). Australia has an open door policty to asylum seekers (oh wait a minute it doesn't does it it ships them off to nearby heavily guarded islands).
Isn't their ongoing racial tensions on Bondi Beach?
Wouldn't it be fair to describe Australia as a fairly bigoted insular island with a history of genocide?
Fidelio wrote:
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.
Can you be specific - what comments are racist? What attitudes are poisonous?
Of course Australia has an open door policy to economic migrants (oh wait a minute it doesn't does it - it expects immigrantts to fend for themselves). Australia has an open door policty to asylum seekers (oh wait a minute it doesn't does it it ships them off to nearby heavily guarded islands).
Isn't their ongoing racial tensions on Bondi Beach?
Wouldn't it be fair to describe Australia as a fairly bigoted insular island with a history of genocide?
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 12:57am Sat 17 Mar 07
Fellacio - perhaps you might want to read this Australian accidemic report on the high levels of intollerance and racism in Australia before you answer.
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:zCXvqgb2NeMJ:www.anu.edu.au/NEC/dunn_paper.pdf+racism+in+Australia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=safari
Fellacio - perhaps you might want to read this Australian accidemic report on the high levels of intollerance and racism in Australia before you answer.
http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:zCXvqgb2NeMJ:www.anu.edu.au/NEC/dunn_paper.pdf+racism+in+Australia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=safari
Posted by: Fidelio, Gold Coast, Australia on 1:06am Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Thomas[/bold] wrote:
Fellacio - perhaps you might want to read this Australian accidemic report on the high levels of intollerance and racism in Australia before you answer. http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:zCXvqgb2NeMJ:www.anu.edu.au/NEC/dunn_paper.pdf+racism+in+Australia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=safari[/quote] Thomas,
For Fellacio, try it with a 't' instead of a 'c'
For accidemic try academic
For intollerance try intolerance
For educution try getting one.
Thomas wrote:
Fellacio - perhaps you might want to read this Australian accidemic report on the high levels of intollerance and racism in Australia before you answer. http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:zCXvqgb2NeMJ:www.anu.edu.au/NEC/dunn_paper.pdf+racism+in+Australia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=safari
Thomas,
For Fellacio, try it with a 't' instead of a 'c'
For accidemic try academic
For intollerance try intolerance
For educution try getting one.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 1:09am Sat 17 Mar 07
For education try reading the suggested Australian report on racism
For keybord skills try being 68 with glasses from the NHS
For sarcasm try answering the question
For education try reading the suggested Australian report on racism
For keybord skills try being 68 with glasses from the NHS
For sarcasm try answering the question
Posted by: Tariq, Allison Street on 1:10am Sat 17 Mar 07
Its so unbelievable to see kids as young as 10 drinking and smoking on the streets. I have never even seen the worst of junkies **** in broad daylight but I have seeen the Czechs do that. They hang about in large groups which is intidmidating to say the least. Glasgow City Council need to act now or trouble is around the corner.
Its so unbelievable to see kids as young as 10 drinking and smoking on the streets. I have never even seen the worst of junkies **** in broad daylight but I have seeen the Czechs do that. They hang about in large groups which is intidmidating to say the least. Glasgow City Council need to act now or trouble is around the corner.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 1:23am Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Fidelio[/bold] wrote:
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.[/quote] I repeat (in case you can't hear - after all you are a very long way away). Can you be specific - what comments are racist? What attitudes are poisonous?
Fidelio wrote:
When I was toying with the idea of taking up an invitation to migrate to Australia, my father told me not to think twice about it as, in his words: "Scotland is a backward, insular little country full of racists and anti-Catholic and anti-Irish bigots."
I was well aware of the widespread institutionalised sectarianism and anti-Catholic bigotry, but had come to believe that the country of my birth was relatively free from the blight of racism.
Reading this article and, more especialy, the sunsequent comments, I have to say my father was 100% correct. No way on earth would I want to raise my children in such a poisonous backwater. You deserve each other.
I repeat (in case you can't hear - after all you are a very long way away). Can you be specific - what comments are racist? What attitudes are poisonous?
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 7:17am Sat 17 Mar 07
At Fidelio:
For 'sunsequent' try subsequent.
Feel like answering Thomas's points yet?
Didn't think so.
At Fidelio:
For 'sunsequent' try subsequent.
Feel like answering Thomas's points yet?
Didn't think so.
Posted by: Des on 8:00am Sat 17 Mar 07
Last night my 76yr old mother was returning from visiting a friend in Pollockshields & she ran out of petrol around 11.30pm on Victoria Rd..She got out the car to call me from a phone box outside the p.office as she had left her mobile at home..Almost immediately she was being harassed by several youths of Eastern European origin for some spare change,bearing in mind she is 76,this was a very distressing incident for her..Three youths wearing so called NED attire came to her rescue,phoned me on their own phone & waited with my mother until i came to get her..
Last night my 76yr old mother was returning from visiting a friend in Pollockshields & she ran out of petrol around 11.30pm on Victoria Rd..She got out the car to call me from a phone box outside the p.office as she had left her mobile at home..Almost immediately she was being harassed by several youths of Eastern European origin for some spare change,bearing in mind she is 76,this was a very distressing incident for her..Three youths wearing so called NED attire came to her rescue,phoned me on their own phone & waited with my mother until i came to get her..
Posted by: Des on 8:13am Sat 17 Mar 07
To continue my last post,how did my mother know they where from Eastern Europe?,well for 30years she taught several foreign languages to business men/women wishing to trade in these countries..I would like to point out that the 3 young men who helped my mother would not take any monies that i offered them & did not make any racist comments about the other party,only voiced the opinion that its a bad day when a pensioner cant walk safely on the streets of Scotland anymore..Thanks again lads
To continue my last post,how did my mother know they where from Eastern Europe?,well for 30years she taught several foreign languages to business men/women wishing to trade in these countries..I would like to point out that the 3 young men who helped my mother would not take any monies that i offered them & did not make any racist comments about the other party,only voiced the opinion that its a bad day when a pensioner cant walk safely on the streets of Scotland anymore..Thanks again lads
Posted by: D, Govanhill on 8:49am Sat 17 Mar 07
I am the proud son of an immigrant, great grandchild of others and the husband of another immigrant. It is with deep frustration and concern that I agree with those voicing anxieties about the Czech/Slovak/Roma community. The experince in our close have been terrible-noise, multiple occupancy, urinating in garden and close stairwell, inability to put domestic waste into bin bag/bin/bin area, keeping washing on line/ground for days on end. I have experience of the slums of African cities' sure there are problems but at least people there have some sense of communal responsibility.I have contacted the council and politicians.{i urge more people to do so} The response has been mixed-some who recognise the problems and want to address them, others who seem to avoid addressing the issues. May I also point my finger squarely at the landlords who make fortunes while turning a blind eye to their tenants and the plight of the neighbours who have to put up with quite frankly, horrendous neighbours.
I am the proud son of an immigrant, great grandchild of others and the husband of another immigrant. It is with deep frustration and concern that I agree with those voicing anxieties about the Czech/Slovak/Roma community. The experince in our close have been terrible-noise, multiple occupancy, urinating in garden and close stairwell, inability to put domestic waste into bin bag/bin/bin area, keeping washing on line/ground for days on end. I have experience of the slums of African cities' sure there are problems but at least people there have some sense of communal responsibility.I have contacted the council and politicians.{i urge more people to do so} The response has been mixed-some who recognise the problems and want to address them, others who seem to avoid addressing the issues. May I also point my finger squarely at the landlords who make fortunes while turning a blind eye to their tenants and the plight of the neighbours who have to put up with quite frankly, horrendous neighbours.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 12:05pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Thomas, I wouldn't double park, but I get your question. Any car double-parked should be on the back of the truck and gone no matter who owns it.
Maybe the ET would like to come down to Dixon Avenue in the middle of the night as part of there parking campaign and highlight the double parked cars. I don't know if we could risk the shock headlines.
Again, Thomas, it is your attitude. You are having a go at the Asian community when double parking is something that every race does. Get yourself up to Mount Florida or Shawlands and slag the white folk that do it.
Your problem should be with the police who aren't doing anything about that problem citywide. Not with people who chose to practice their religion on a Friday.
BTW - NED doesn't stand for Non-educated deliquent. Anyone who believes that may find they are [italic]uneducated.[/italic] It derivates from Edward around the time of the Teddy Boys and relates to the more unsavoury elements of that group. That ones who were more into trouble than the gear and clothing. It hung around, rarely used, in the 60's and 70' before rising in popularity in the 80's.
Des, you are an economic migrant. That's not an insult and has nothing to do with how much money you have in your pocket. You'll be creating a better life for you and those of who you employ. That's economics. And I do wish you well too.
Sadly, I think MikeCraig summed up the attitude of a lot of Glaswegians.
"What do we owe these people?"
We don't owe them anything, but it would be good to give them some respect.
Thomas, I wouldn't double park, but I get your question. Any car double-parked should be on the back of the truck and gone no matter who owns it.
Maybe the ET would like to come down to Dixon Avenue in the middle of the night as part of there parking campaign and highlight the double parked cars. I don't know if we could risk the shock headlines.
Again, Thomas, it is your attitude. You are having a go at the Asian community when double parking is something that every race does. Get yourself up to Mount Florida or Shawlands and slag the white folk that do it.
Your problem should be with the police who aren't doing anything about that problem citywide. Not with people who chose to practice their religion on a Friday.
BTW - NED doesn't stand for Non-educated deliquent. Anyone who believes that may find they are
uneducated. It derivates from Edward around the time of the Teddy Boys and relates to the more unsavoury elements of that group. That ones who were more into trouble than the gear and clothing. It hung around, rarely used, in the 60's and 70' before rising in popularity in the 80's.
Des, you are an economic migrant. That's not an insult and has nothing to do with how much money you have in your pocket. You'll be creating a better life for you and those of who you employ. That's economics. And I do wish you well too.
Sadly, I think MikeCraig summed up the attitude of a lot of Glaswegians.
"What do we owe these people?"
We don't owe them anything, but it would be good to give them some respect.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 12:10pm Sat 17 Mar 07
all typos in the above noted, thanks. ;-)
all typos in the above noted, thanks. ;-)
Posted by: stew, govanhill on 12:26pm Sat 17 Mar 07
the problem in the area isnt all eastern europeans as most polish etc can find work it is the slovakian romanies who are are not willing to work and wont register for work wonder if this comment upsets the pc brigade who never seem to come from govanhill
the problem in the area isnt all eastern europeans as most polish etc can find work it is the slovakian romanies who are are not willing to work and wont register for work wonder if this comment upsets the pc brigade who never seem to come from govanhill
Posted by: govan-hill, langside road on 1:04pm Sat 17 Mar 07
This is a problem that certain landlords are making worse because they are the ones making money out of families who have no other option but to live in overcrowded flats.
This is a known problem in Govanhill.
You can report bad landlords to the council, there is a register for landlords and those who aren't on it or meeting its requirements can be prosecuted. Use the council. That's what its there for.
The landlords who pack out flats have no regard for housing quality, if the area 'goes downhill' that means they can buy more flats on the cheap.
I like living in Govanhill as its diversity is like nowhere else in Glasgow. Yep there are some tensions but at the end of the day we're all the same folk. We need to be using the powers available, ie reporting incidents/landlords to the council and police so the system gets sorted out, rather than in-fighting and descending into futile racism vs pc arguments.
This is a problem that certain landlords are making worse because they are the ones making money out of families who have no other option but to live in overcrowded flats.
This is a known problem in Govanhill.
You can report bad landlords to the council, there is a register for landlords and those who aren't on it or meeting its requirements can be prosecuted. Use the council. That's what its there for.
The landlords who pack out flats have no regard for housing quality, if the area 'goes downhill' that means they can buy more flats on the cheap.
I like living in Govanhill as its diversity is like nowhere else in Glasgow. Yep there are some tensions but at the end of the day we're all the same folk. We need to be using the powers available, ie reporting incidents/landlords to the council and police so the system gets sorted out, rather than in-fighting and descending into futile racism vs pc arguments.
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 1:06pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Ok firstly, Im not calling people racist, altho there are some veiws that could be seen as racist.
Also, when I propose to do something for the community, I dont mean a little one off event, I mean ongoing workshops to help bring the kids together, also get the parents involved more.
Even if this is seen as nothing, or not much, its better than nothing ... and I for one would like to at least try.
Ok firstly, Im not calling people racist, altho there are some veiws that could be seen as racist.
Also, when I propose to do something for the community, I dont mean a little one off event, I mean ongoing workshops to help bring the kids together, also get the parents involved more.
Even if this is seen as nothing, or not much, its better than nothing ... and I for one would like to at least try.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 1:17pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Grant[/bold] wrote:
Thomas, I wouldn't double park, but I get your question. Any car double-parked should be on the back of the truck and gone no matter who owns it.
Maybe the ET would like to come down to Dixon Avenue in the middle of the night as part of there parking campaign and highlight the double parked cars. I don't know if we could risk the shock headlines.
Again, Thomas, it is your attitude. You are having a go at the Asian community when double parking is something that every race does. Get yourself up to Mount Florida or Shawlands and slag the white folk that do it.
Your problem should be with the police who aren't doing anything about that problem citywide. Not with people who chose to practice their religion on a Friday.
BTW - NED doesn't stand for Non-educated deliquent. Anyone who believes that may find they are [italic]uneducated.[/italic] It derivates from Edward around the time of the Teddy Boys and relates to the more unsavoury elements of that group. That ones who were more into trouble than the gear and clothing. It hung around, rarely used, in the 60's and 70' before rising in popularity in the 80's.
Des, you are an economic migrant. That's not an insult and has nothing to do with how much money you have in your pocket. You'll be creating a better life for you and those of who you employ. That's economics. And I do wish you well too.
Sadly, I think MikeCraig summed up the attitude of a lot of Glaswegians.
"What do we owe these people?"
We don't owe them anything, but it would be good to give them some respect.[/quote] Grant - I am refering to my friend's home near Butterbiggins Road.
On a Friday the entire area is flooded with cars - double, triple, quadrouple parked for half a day. A dozens cars parked on pavements.
A disgraceful disrespect for the residential community - there is no way for anyone to get in or out. Not the same as the problem you are discribing citywide.
I disagree - it is a problem for the people who use the Mosque on Butterbiggins road - they chose to open the mosque in a residential area and choose to commit criminal acts every time they come to pray. It has been a pain in the backside for years.
Am I a racist for mentioning this?
I have complained to the Mosque and to the police - action happens for a week or two - but the problem returns worse than ever.
Whatever the origin for NED (and your history lesson is irrelevent to my point) - which was - we have enough delinquents of our own (both white and brown) we don't need to import the rejects from Eastern Europe. These people were paid to leave Slovakia by their govenment.
As ecconomic migrants they are subject to market forces - if they can't make a go of things and are unwanted here then they should (as martket forces dictate) move on.
Indeed what do we owe these people?
Grant wrote:
Thomas, I wouldn't double park, but I get your question. Any car double-parked should be on the back of the truck and gone no matter who owns it.
Maybe the ET would like to come down to Dixon Avenue in the middle of the night as part of there parking campaign and highlight the double parked cars. I don't know if we could risk the shock headlines.
Again, Thomas, it is your attitude. You are having a go at the Asian community when double parking is something that every race does. Get yourself up to Mount Florida or Shawlands and slag the white folk that do it.
Your problem should be with the police who aren't doing anything about that problem citywide. Not with people who chose to practice their religion on a Friday.
BTW - NED doesn't stand for Non-educated deliquent. Anyone who believes that may find they are uneducated. It derivates from Edward around the time of the Teddy Boys and relates to the more unsavoury elements of that group. That ones who were more into trouble than the gear and clothing. It hung around, rarely used, in the 60's and 70' before rising in popularity in the 80's.
Des, you are an economic migrant. That's not an insult and has nothing to do with how much money you have in your pocket. You'll be creating a better life for you and those of who you employ. That's economics. And I do wish you well too.
Sadly, I think MikeCraig summed up the attitude of a lot of Glaswegians.
"What do we owe these people?"
We don't owe them anything, but it would be good to give them some respect.
Grant - I am refering to my friend's home near Butterbiggins Road.
On a Friday the entire area is flooded with cars - double, triple, quadrouple parked for half a day. A dozens cars parked on pavements.
A disgraceful disrespect for the residential community - there is no way for anyone to get in or out. Not the same as the problem you are discribing citywide.
I disagree - it is a problem for the people who use the Mosque on Butterbiggins road - they chose to open the mosque in a residential area and choose to commit criminal acts every time they come to pray. It has been a pain in the backside for years.
Am I a racist for mentioning this?
I have complained to the Mosque and to the police - action happens for a week or two - but the problem returns worse than ever.
Whatever the origin for NED (and your history lesson is irrelevent to my point) - which was - we have enough delinquents of our own (both white and brown) we don't need to import the rejects from Eastern Europe. These people were paid to leave Slovakia by their govenment.
As ecconomic migrants they are subject to market forces - if they can't make a go of things and are unwanted here then they should (as martket forces dictate) move on.
Indeed what do we owe these people?
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 1:23pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Riz[/bold] wrote:
Ok firstly, Im not calling people racist, altho there are some veiws that could be seen as racist.
Also, when I propose to do something for the community, I dont mean a little one off event, I mean ongoing workshops to help bring the kids together, also get the parents involved more.
Even if this is seen as nothing, or not much, its better than nothing ... and I for one would like to at least try.[/quote] "Some views that could be seen as racist"
Like what?
How about putting you thinking cap on and working out how to deal with the delinquents we already have - and by god don't we have a lot.
Riz I am sure you are a well meaning man with much to offer - and I wish you the bast of luck with all your endevours - but if you are accusing people of being racists because they have a problem with Govanhill being the dumping ground for Gypsies that Slovakia has paid to leave then you are up a gum tree.
Riz wrote:
Ok firstly, Im not calling people racist, altho there are some veiws that could be seen as racist.
Also, when I propose to do something for the community, I dont mean a little one off event, I mean ongoing workshops to help bring the kids together, also get the parents involved more.
Even if this is seen as nothing, or not much, its better than nothing ... and I for one would like to at least try.
"Some views that could be seen as racist"
Like what?
How about putting you thinking cap on and working out how to deal with the delinquents we already have - and by god don't we have a lot.
Riz I am sure you are a well meaning man with much to offer - and I wish you the bast of luck with all your endevours - but if you are accusing people of being racists because they have a problem with Govanhill being the dumping ground for Gypsies that Slovakia has paid to leave then you are up a gum tree.
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 1:43pm Sat 17 Mar 07
We dont owe them anything ... I dont think anyone has said that we do BUT as a person I am nice to everyone and anyone, Its nice to be nice and all that.
I total understand the issues about parking, I total understand what people are saying when they mention the people urinating in the stairwell, the gardens, Washing hanging up for days on end, and peope hanging about corners.
A Samaritan on a loney road and all that.
Where people (In my humble opinion, and it is just mine) get things wrong is to on one side blast people for being the "PC Brigade" when in all honesty Im not, I think its daft that a black board aint a black board anymore and a white board is now a wipe board, its not a green man to cross the road now its a green person etc etc etc its all very stupid, but then again I also think that branding people racist every two minutes is stupid also for having an opinion that differs from others.
What some people are saying on here has racist implications, and the less educated and wet behind the ears kinda person could take what your saying out of context and make it a race issue, when really this IS NOT A RACE ISSUE.
Both sides of the fence here have common ground. I dont want to see people in poverty, born and bred Glaswegians or otherwise, I myself am an adopted Glaswegian from the East coast! I dont want people not taking their rubbish out, I dont want fly tippers in the street, I live here too and it drives me mad too.
BUT what we need to do is look at the reasons for these problems, look at the grassroot problem, educate both parties, integrate better, discuss things out in the open, as whispers can often leed to hatered. I very much doubt that the Eastern Europeans even know themselves that they are causing any sort of debate on here. Not to generalise but even if thay had access to a PC would they use it and can they even read this as its all in English!
I guess what Im saying is you seem to have two sides here discussing/argueing this out BUT we both want the same results and we are technically the same side. The blame sits with Jack McConnell and those who live is upclass areas who sign thier name to a peice of paper and say yeh sent them there. WE THE RESIDENTS ARE NOT INFORMED, CONSULTED OR IN ANYWAY TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION, we are but the working ants (without trying to sound silly) and our opinion isnt worth anything. For what its worth I am a socialist and I will be voting Solidarity on May 3rd.
In conclusion I welcome the immigrants, I donot welcome the situations that they have brought with them and more should have been done before hand to make sure their moving in would be handled better, but hey, spilt milk and all that .. lets build to the future now, the situation is here, it is real and we all have our part to play, Both the Immigrants AND us
We dont owe them anything ... I dont think anyone has said that we do BUT as a person I am nice to everyone and anyone, Its nice to be nice and all that.
I total understand the issues about parking, I total understand what people are saying when they mention the people urinating in the stairwell, the gardens, Washing hanging up for days on end, and peope hanging about corners.
A Samaritan on a loney road and all that.
Where people (In my humble opinion, and it is just mine) get things wrong is to on one side blast people for being the "PC Brigade" when in all honesty Im not, I think its daft that a black board aint a black board anymore and a white board is now a wipe board, its not a green man to cross the road now its a green person etc etc etc its all very stupid, but then again I also think that branding people racist every two minutes is stupid also for having an opinion that differs from others.
What some people are saying on here has racist implications, and the less educated and wet behind the ears kinda person could take what your saying out of context and make it a race issue, when really this IS NOT A RACE ISSUE.
Both sides of the fence here have common ground. I dont want to see people in poverty, born and bred Glaswegians or otherwise, I myself am an adopted Glaswegian from the East coast! I dont want people not taking their rubbish out, I dont want fly tippers in the street, I live here too and it drives me mad too.
BUT what we need to do is look at the reasons for these problems, look at the grassroot problem, educate both parties, integrate better, discuss things out in the open, as whispers can often leed to hatered. I very much doubt that the Eastern Europeans even know themselves that they are causing any sort of debate on here. Not to generalise but even if thay had access to a PC would they use it and can they even read this as its all in English!
I guess what Im saying is you seem to have two sides here discussing/argueing this out BUT we both want the same results and we are technically the same side. The blame sits with Jack McConnell and those who live is upclass areas who sign thier name to a peice of paper and say yeh sent them there. WE THE RESIDENTS ARE NOT INFORMED, CONSULTED OR IN ANYWAY TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION, we are but the working ants (without trying to sound silly) and our opinion isnt worth anything. For what its worth I am a socialist and I will be voting Solidarity on May 3rd.
In conclusion I welcome the immigrants, I donot welcome the situations that they have brought with them and more should have been done before hand to make sure their moving in would be handled better, but hey, spilt milk and all that .. lets build to the future now, the situation is here, it is real and we all have our part to play, Both the Immigrants AND us
Posted by: Rob, Sydney, Australia on 1:52pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Posted by: Thomas, 543-837 on 1:59pm Sat 17 Mar 07
I can only repeat -
Economic migrants and the entire concept of open European borders only makes sense if it is governed by marlet forces. That is just a simple fact. Slovakia paid for these people to leave.
We are being dumped with their socail problem and people are asking - What on earth do these people have to do with us??
The people I feel for are the many Eastern Europeans who are living in the South Side of Glasgow who are dragged into this.
If you choose to move to America, Canada, Singapore, Australia, New Zealand you have to pass very tough tests of your credability as a migrant. Some people feel that perhaps immigrants should face tests to be allowed into the UK.
EU citizens have no restrictions on movement - their movement is governed by economics - giving addition assistence to these Gypsies is doing a great disservice to the many able willing and welcome Europeans who are coming here under their own steam.
If the Slovakian Gypsies have little to offer why should we have to be responsible for thie social services - that isn't what open European borders is about.
I can only repeat -
Economic migrants and the entire concept of open European borders only makes sense if it is governed by marlet forces. That is just a simple fact. Slovakia paid for these people to leave.
We are being dumped with their socail problem and people are asking - What on earth do these people have to do with us??
The people I feel for are the many Eastern Europeans who are living in the South Side of Glasgow who are dragged into this.
If you choose to move to America, Canada, Singapore, Australia, New Zealand you have to pass very tough tests of your credability as a migrant. Some people feel that perhaps immigrants should face tests to be allowed into the UK.
EU citizens have no restrictions on movement - their movement is governed by economics - giving addition assistence to these Gypsies is doing a great disservice to the many able willing and welcome Europeans who are coming here under their own steam.
If the Slovakian Gypsies have little to offer why should we have to be responsible for thie social services - that isn't what open European borders is about.
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 1:59pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Thomas, thanks for your word of encouragement, and for the record, as I said you may not be racist, BUT things said can come across to others as racist, the word "Gypsy" for a start. If anything they are "Travelling people", Gypsy comes from the times when people thought Romanians were Egyptian and thus people refered to them as "Gypo" or "Gypsy" anyway ...
On another note, I was out in Australia last year as part of my tour and I was refered to as a "Pom", when I and my mate took offence, ,y friend a white Glaswegian he was called a "wog" as prior to Australia I had just done the Canadian leg of the tour and we got alot of sun. The offending Australian then said these exact words "dont blame us, we are just ignorant" We couldnt believe it, as they refered to football as "Wog Ball" and so on, and they never once thought that it was really racist ... funny how people see things different.
Thomas, thanks for your word of encouragement, and for the record, as I said you may not be racist, BUT things said can come across to others as racist, the word "Gypsy" for a start. If anything they are "Travelling people", Gypsy comes from the times when people thought Romanians were Egyptian and thus people refered to them as "Gypo" or "Gypsy" anyway ...
On another note, I was out in Australia last year as part of my tour and I was refered to as a "Pom", when I and my mate took offence, ,y friend a white Glaswegian he was called a "wog" as prior to Australia I had just done the Canadian leg of the tour and we got alot of sun. The offending Australian then said these exact words "dont blame us, we are just ignorant" We couldnt believe it, as they refered to football as "Wog Ball" and so on, and they never once thought that it was really racist ... funny how people see things different.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 2:10pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Riz[/bold] wrote:
Thomas, thanks for your word of encouragement, and for the record, as I said you may not be racist, BUT things said can come across to others as racist, the word "Gypsy" for a start. If anything they are "Travelling people", Gypsy comes from the times when people thought Romanians were Egyptian and thus people refered to them as "Gypo" or "Gypsy" anyway ...
On another note, I was out in Australia last year as part of my tour and I was refered to as a "Pom", when I and my mate took offence, ,y friend a white Glaswegian he was called a "wog" as prior to Australia I had just done the Canadian leg of the tour and we got alot of sun. The offending Australian then said these exact words "dont blame us, we are just ignorant" We couldnt believe it, as they refered to football as "Wog Ball" and so on, and they never once thought that it was really racist ... funny how people see things different.[/quote] A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.
I will remember the next time I am stopped by a "travelling person" of the female persuasion and given her begging "act" that I am being a borderline racist. When I refuse to hand over any cash and she summons up a curse i will see it as a colourful addition to my walk down Victoria Road.
Don't see the relevance of your stories for your Australian trip.
Riz wrote:
Thomas, thanks for your word of encouragement, and for the record, as I said you may not be racist, BUT things said can come across to others as racist, the word "Gypsy" for a start. If anything they are "Travelling people", Gypsy comes from the times when people thought Romanians were Egyptian and thus people refered to them as "Gypo" or "Gypsy" anyway ...
On another note, I was out in Australia last year as part of my tour and I was refered to as a "Pom", when I and my mate took offence, ,y friend a white Glaswegian he was called a "wog" as prior to Australia I had just done the Canadian leg of the tour and we got alot of sun. The offending Australian then said these exact words "dont blame us, we are just ignorant" We couldnt believe it, as they refered to football as "Wog Ball" and so on, and they never once thought that it was really racist ... funny how people see things different.
A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.
I will remember the next time I am stopped by a "travelling person" of the female persuasion and given her begging "act" that I am being a borderline racist. When I refuse to hand over any cash and she summons up a curse i will see it as a colourful addition to my walk down Victoria Road.
Don't see the relevance of your stories for your Australian trip.
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 2:36pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Let me repeat, Im not saying your a racist, Im just saying how some people may see it. Yo asked me to point it out and I did so. You seem an educated well focused and level headed person.
As for the Australian thing, I mentioned it as there was another guy talking about what life is like in Oz, its not all about you you know! lol :)
Let me repeat, Im not saying your a racist, Im just saying how some people may see it. Yo asked me to point it out and I did so. You seem an educated well focused and level headed person.
As for the Australian thing, I mentioned it as there was another guy talking about what life is like in Oz, its not all about you you know! lol :)
Posted by: Ally Cain on 2:48pm Sat 17 Mar 07
There is really not much substance to this article. Apart from the allegation of "rioting" -allegedy for an hour with out a single cop in attendance, which resulted in no injuries and just one arrest? Pull the other one Evening Times.
The whole piece has been fattened out with a raft of quotes from the usual suspects. And the issue of double-parked cars and/or unsupervised children roaming the streets is certainly an annoying probleb, and definately a multi-cultural issue. So hardly reliable evidence of an impending civil war amongst "races" is it?
An irresponsable piece of lazy journalism from the Evening Times which in my experience normaly tends to be more balanced in reflecting Glasgow's diverse communties.
There is really not much substance to this article. Apart from the allegation of "rioting" -allegedy for an hour with out a single cop in attendance, which resulted in no injuries and just one arrest? Pull the other one Evening Times.
The whole piece has been fattened out with a raft of quotes from the usual suspects. And the issue of double-parked cars and/or unsupervised children roaming the streets is certainly an annoying probleb, and definately a multi-cultural issue. So hardly reliable evidence of an impending civil war amongst "races" is it?
An irresponsable piece of lazy journalism from the Evening Times which in my experience normaly tends to be more balanced in reflecting Glasgow's diverse communties.
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 2:49pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Riz,
Perhaps 'Roma' is a more accurate term that 'Travelling People' but they are still gypsies:
[italic]The Roma (also known in English as "Gypsies") form the second largest minority group in Slovakia.[/italic]
http://www.slovakia.org/society-roma.htm
Riz,
Perhaps 'Roma' is a more accurate term that 'Travelling People' but they are still gypsies:
The Roma (also known in English as "Gypsies") form the second largest minority group in Slovakia.
http://www.slovakia.org/society-roma.htm
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 3:04pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Riz[/bold] wrote:
Let me repeat, Im not saying your a racist, Im just saying how some people may see it. Yo asked me to point it out and I did so. You seem an educated well focused and level headed person.
As for the Australian thing, I mentioned it as there was another guy talking about what life is like in Oz, its not all about you you know! lol :)[/quote] How can you see how other people may see it? Are you gifted with telepathic powers? We might have a more useful discussion if you let people speak for themselves.
I presumed that your references to racism in Australian society as being linked as they were both on the same topic - or is that just how some people might see it.
Riz wrote:
Let me repeat, Im not saying your a racist, Im just saying how some people may see it. Yo asked me to point it out and I did so. You seem an educated well focused and level headed person.
As for the Australian thing, I mentioned it as there was another guy talking about what life is like in Oz, its not all about you you know! lol :)
How can you see how other people may see it? Are you gifted with telepathic powers? We might have a more useful discussion if you let people speak for themselves.
I presumed that your references to racism in Australian society as being linked as they were both on the same topic - or is that just how some people might see it.
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 3:21pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Im not telepathic but a gypsies caravan has just double parked outside my front door and after crossing her palm with a giro she foretold me of this discussion :)
of course I jehst
Im not telepathic but a gypsies caravan has just double parked outside my front door and after crossing her palm with a giro she foretold me of this discussion :)
of course I jehst
Posted by: lee, glasgow on 3:25pm Sat 17 Mar 07
I just think its pretty obvious why the people with absolutley no intention of working, contributing or integrating into our society come to our shores. We, (Britain) are seen as a soft touch in Europe with free state handouts and housing.
While most migrants come here with the intention of working and making a better life for themselves there is that element that doesnt and seem quite happy to play the system. Half the countries these people come from are glad to see the bk of them and actively encourage them to come here. Im all for tolerance but how much more is the decent hardworking people of our society of all races, colours and religions prepared to put up with this sort of thing? People who come here need to make the effort and if not then they should return to their homeland and stop taking the p***
I just think its pretty obvious why the people with absolutley no intention of working, contributing or integrating into our society come to our shores. We, (Britain) are seen as a soft touch in Europe with free state handouts and housing.
While most migrants come here with the intention of working and making a better life for themselves there is that element that doesnt and seem quite happy to play the system. Half the countries these people come from are glad to see the bk of them and actively encourage them to come here. Im all for tolerance but how much more is the decent hardworking people of our society of all races, colours and religions prepared to put up with this sort of thing? People who come here need to make the effort and if not then they should return to their homeland and stop taking the p***
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 3:27pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote]Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.[/quote]
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas.
This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants.
To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense.
We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began.
It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas.
This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants.
To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense.
We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began.
It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
Posted by: Doug, Cathcart on 3:28pm Sat 17 Mar 07
John, your reaction proves everything I have said. I hope you one day wake up with the country you deserve!
And before labelling tolerant people as PC liberals, you should check your facts.
You have shown yourself to be an intolerant buffoon. Pure and simple. Enjoy your unhappy little mind.
John, your reaction proves everything I have said. I hope you one day wake up with the country you deserve!
And before labelling tolerant people as PC liberals, you should check your facts.
You have shown yourself to be an intolerant buffoon. Pure and simple. Enjoy your unhappy little mind.
Posted by: Matt, 954-366 on 3:38pm Sat 17 Mar 07
..........I think I will move back to Coatbridge...........don't feel welcome here!
..........I think I will move back to Coatbridge...........don't feel welcome here!
Posted by: jimmy, glesga thrunthru on 3:52pm Sat 17 Mar 07
what happend to free speach, 2 postings removed for telling it like it is. get rid of the whole lot of them and any you numptys that disagree go with them, you wont be missed.
what happend to free speach, 2 postings removed for telling it like it is. get rid of the whole lot of them and any you numptys that disagree go with them, you wont be missed.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 3:54pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
[quote]Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.[/quote]
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas.
This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants.
To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense.
We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began.
It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
[/quote] Ally - I don't need a history lesson.
"Hysterical ignorant nonsense" Grow up.
Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years.
Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE.
Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history.
You mention Genetics - I didn't.
Don't try putting words in my mouth.
Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950's haven't made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation.
People who chose to come here prosper or they don't - they fit in or they don't.
It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn't the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.
Ally Cain wrote:
Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950's has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas.
This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants.
To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense.
We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began.
It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
Ally - I don't need a history lesson.
"Hysterical ignorant nonsense" Grow up.
Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years.
Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE.
Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history.
You mention Genetics - I didn't.
Don't try putting words in my mouth.
Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950's haven't made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation.
People who chose to come here prosper or they don't - they fit in or they don't.
It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn't the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.
Posted by: Grant, Crosshill on 4:11pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Thomas, I'm not calling you or anyone else here a racist. I don't agree with most of what you say, but I think we want the same things in the area.
Riz's post at 1.43pm pretty much says how I feel.
Thomas, I'm not calling you or anyone else here a racist. I don't agree with most of what you say, but I think we want the same things in the area.
Riz's post at 1.43pm pretty much says how I feel.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 4:17pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Grant[/bold] wrote:
Thomas, I'm not calling you or anyone else here a racist. I don't agree with most of what you say, but I think we want the same things in the area.
Riz's post at 1.43pm pretty much says how I feel.[/quote] You don't agree with most of what I have said.
For instance...
Grant wrote:
Thomas, I'm not calling you or anyone else here a racist. I don't agree with most of what you say, but I think we want the same things in the area.
Riz's post at 1.43pm pretty much says how I feel.
You don't agree with most of what I have said.
For instance...
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 4:28pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Thomas[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote: [quote]Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950\'s has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.[/quote] I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas. This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants. To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense. We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began. It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now. [/quote] Ally - I don\'t need a history lesson. \"Hysterical ignorant nonsense\" Grow up. Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years. Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE. Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history. You mention Genetics - I didn\'t. Don\'t try putting words in my mouth. Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950\'s haven\'t made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation. People who chose to come here prosper or they don\'t - they fit in or they don\'t. It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn\'t the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.[/quote] Oh dear wind your neck back in Thomas and seriously you should brush up the entire history of this island rather than just cherry pick whatever suits your personal prejudices.
As for British culture? You mean incomers should adopt the entire mass diversity of it? Why should they when the resident population don't or more likely they can't?
Or are you attempting to push that nationalistic myth "All British Good-All Foreigner Bad" upon the agog congregation? :)
Have you ever considered the notion that the bad in all our different cultures should be isolated and dealt with accordingly rather than lay the blame on the majority of their cultural origins, whether they be British or immigrants?
Thomas wrote:
Ally Cain wrote: Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950\'s has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas. This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants. To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense. We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began. It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
Ally - I don\'t need a history lesson. \"Hysterical ignorant nonsense\" Grow up. Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years. Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE. Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history. You mention Genetics - I didn\'t. Don\'t try putting words in my mouth. Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950\'s haven\'t made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation. People who chose to come here prosper or they don\'t - they fit in or they don\'t. It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn\'t the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.
Oh dear wind your neck back in Thomas and seriously you should brush up the entire history of this island rather than just cherry pick whatever suits your personal prejudices.
As for British culture? You mean incomers should adopt the entire mass diversity of it? Why should they when the resident population don't or more likely they can't?
Or are you attempting to push that nationalistic myth "All British Good-All Foreigner Bad" upon the agog congregation? :)
Have you ever considered the notion that the bad in all our different cultures should be isolated and dealt with accordingly rather than lay the blame on the majority of their cultural origins, whether they be British or immigrants?
Posted by: Doug, Cathcart on 4:29pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Who we are, where we are and what we are are accidents of birth.
I could have been born a prince or a pauper, but i wasn't. I could have been born in Africa or Asia, but i wasn't.
It is perfectly fine to be proud of who you are, what you and where you are but the person you take a dislike to for their race, colour, religion or suchlike, could have been you.
To dislike people because they are just not your kind of people is also fine. We make our own friends and our own choices.
I have worked with people from all sorts of backgrounds and all parts of Scotland, Europe, Asia, Africa and beyond.
I cannot honestly say that any one bunch were worse or better than another. There were good folk and there were chancers, whether they were from Maryhill, Munich or Madras.
For example, every family has its bad apples, and its hard-working good souls. Let's not get into a ridiculous situation of hating people because they are "no like us". That is how genocide starts. However, i do not think we will have any race wars here! But that is my point so i will not labour it any more!
Who we are, where we are and what we are are accidents of birth.
I could have been born a prince or a pauper, but i wasn't. I could have been born in Africa or Asia, but i wasn't.
It is perfectly fine to be proud of who you are, what you and where you are but the person you take a dislike to for their race, colour, religion or suchlike, could have been you.
To dislike people because they are just not your kind of people is also fine. We make our own friends and our own choices.
I have worked with people from all sorts of backgrounds and all parts of Scotland, Europe, Asia, Africa and beyond.
I cannot honestly say that any one bunch were worse or better than another. There were good folk and there were chancers, whether they were from Maryhill, Munich or Madras.
For example, every family has its bad apples, and its hard-working good souls. Let's not get into a ridiculous situation of hating people because they are "no like us". That is how genocide starts. However, i do not think we will have any race wars here! But that is my point so i will not labour it any more!
Posted by: Des on 4:31pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Rob[/bold] wrote:
Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...[/quote] Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
Rob wrote:
Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 4:58pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Thomas[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote: [quote]Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950\'s has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.[/quote] I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas. This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants. To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense. We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began. It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now. [/quote] Ally - I don\'t need a history lesson. \"Hysterical ignorant nonsense\" Grow up. Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years. Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE. Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history. You mention Genetics - I didn\'t. Don\'t try putting words in my mouth. Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950\'s haven\'t made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation. People who chose to come here prosper or they don\'t - they fit in or they don\'t. It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn\'t the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.[/quote] Oh dear wind your neck back in Thomas and seriously you should brush up the entire history of this island rather than just cherry pick whatever suits your personal prejudices.
As for British culture? You mean incomers should adopt the entire mass diversity of it? Why should they when the resident population don't or more likely they can't?
Or are you attempting to push that nationalistic myth "All British Good-All Foreigner Bad" upon the agog congregation? :)
Have you ever considered the notion that the bad in all our different cultures should be isolated and dealt with accordingly rather than lay the blame on the majority of their cultural origins, whether they be British or immigrants?
[/quote] History is all about perspectives.
I haven't cherry picked - just stated facts.
Small scale immigration has always gone on.
Large scale mass immigration if a fairly new event.
Immigrants should be prepared to adopt the culture and traditions of the country they have chosen to come to.
Culture is changing all the time - it is a process - but not one that is imposed from above. Things that work and become popular become part of the general culture.
We all exist in micro cultures - but they are geographic and not racial.
I have stated several times in this thread that there are many things wrong with Glasgow. Indeed there is much wrong with Britain.
You have used the coda "British Good-All Foreigner Bad" not me.
If I see a group paid by their government to leave - and they end up here - I wonder why. Shouldn't I?
If I see an open European Union with the mass movement of many able and intelligent people I am excited at the possibilities.
You are confusing issues here not me.
Economic migration within the EU has lots of potential.
Dumping groups of people on the other side of Europe from one state to another has raised many questions - is it appropriate? Why are these Roma suddenly the responsibility of Glasgow.
Why did Slovakia pay them to leave?
Perhaps you would prefer it is we were afraid to ask such questions.
Ally Cain wrote:
Thomas wrote:
Ally Cain wrote: Britain has seen a lot since the cavemen - mostly the migration of differnt Celtic tribes and Norsemen. Only since the 1950\'s has it seen the mass migration of alien cultures. 50 years later and they are as alien as ever.
I think you need to brush up on British history Thomas. This Island was a mass of several different kingdoms througout the centuries, and the diversity of cultures that evolved through them included a whole host of Europeans;Irish, German, Norman, Swedish, French, Spanish, Italian etc etc as well as African, Middle East, Chinese and Indian migrants. To suggest that Britain was one nation, one culture, one colour, etc only until 50 years ago is hysterical ignorant nonsense. We have been importing voluntary migrants, or had our ancient kingdoms colonised by foreign nations, for as long as historic records began. It is therefore fair to suggest that a 100% genetic Brit would be very much a minority not only today but for many centuries now.
Ally - I don\'t need a history lesson. \"Hysterical ignorant nonsense\" Grow up. Mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has only been in effect for about 50 years. Peoples from many lands have come and gone - in relatively small numbers has been normal for centuries OF COURSE. Large scale mass immigration from out-with Northern Europe has not been a normal part of British history. You mention Genetics - I didn\'t. Don\'t try putting words in my mouth. Being British is a choice - a choice that many who have been part of the Mass migrations since the 1950\'s haven\'t made - they remain culturally part of a foreign nation. People who chose to come here prosper or they don\'t - they fit in or they don\'t. It is the responsibility of people coming here to make a go of their life. It isn\'t the responsibility of this country to bend over backwards for them.
Oh dear wind your neck back in Thomas and seriously you should brush up the entire history of this island rather than just cherry pick whatever suits your personal prejudices.
As for British culture? You mean incomers should adopt the entire mass diversity of it? Why should they when the resident population don't or more likely they can't?
Or are you attempting to push that nationalistic myth "All British Good-All Foreigner Bad" upon the agog congregation? :)
Have you ever considered the notion that the bad in all our different cultures should be isolated and dealt with accordingly rather than lay the blame on the majority of their cultural origins, whether they be British or immigrants?
History is all about perspectives.
I haven't cherry picked - just stated facts.
Small scale immigration has always gone on.
Large scale mass immigration if a fairly new event.
Immigrants should be prepared to adopt the culture and traditions of the country they have chosen to come to.
Culture is changing all the time - it is a process - but not one that is imposed from above. Things that work and become popular become part of the general culture.
We all exist in micro cultures - but they are geographic and not racial.
I have stated several times in this thread that there are many things wrong with Glasgow. Indeed there is much wrong with Britain.
You have used the coda "British Good-All Foreigner Bad" not me.
If I see a group paid by their government to leave - and they end up here - I wonder why. Shouldn't I?
If I see an open European Union with the mass movement of many able and intelligent people I am excited at the possibilities.
You are confusing issues here not me.
Economic migration within the EU has lots of potential.
Dumping groups of people on the other side of Europe from one state to another has raised many questions - is it appropriate? Why are these Roma suddenly the responsibility of Glasgow.
Why did Slovakia pay them to leave?
Perhaps you would prefer it is we were afraid to ask such questions.
Posted by: lee on 5:05pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Rob[/bold] wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...[/quote] Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)[/quote] A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.
Des wrote:
Rob wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.
Posted by: Branislav, Glasgow on 5:16pm Sat 17 Mar 07
I come read your emails here in Scotland and dissapoint. I want to work here as no chance of good lives back home. I want to work hard like Scottish people do and provide my family.
I am sorry if some people not adapt to culture but we are new and learning. I work in large hotel in Glasgow as waiter but am graduate. Slovakia is poor country unless your family one of historic richer, mine is not.
I am sharing apartments with several others, all legal workers. I am worried that with what people like Johns, Des and Thomas that i should not be here. You are welcome in my country spending your money please it helps us. I wil try too to spend here but my money pays rent and food for my wife.
I think Rosie is yes good person as are oethers, Riz, Ally, Grant and Doug. You seem like most Glasgows people. They are friendly with us but reading this makes me sad.
I say to all, please dont think we want trouble. We want earn and have good life.
I am sorry for trouble of bad few peoples.
I come read your emails here in Scotland and dissapoint. I want to work here as no chance of good lives back home. I want to work hard like Scottish people do and provide my family.
I am sorry if some people not adapt to culture but we are new and learning. I work in large hotel in Glasgow as waiter but am graduate. Slovakia is poor country unless your family one of historic richer, mine is not.
I am sharing apartments with several others, all legal workers. I am worried that with what people like Johns, Des and Thomas that i should not be here. You are welcome in my country spending your money please it helps us. I wil try too to spend here but my money pays rent and food for my wife.
I think Rosie is yes good person as are oethers, Riz, Ally, Grant and Doug. You seem like most Glasgows people. They are friendly with us but reading this makes me sad.
I say to all, please dont think we want trouble. We want earn and have good life.
I am sorry for trouble of bad few peoples.
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 5:17pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Here in the South Side we have the most ethnically diverse population in Scotland.
Sure there are trouble spots here and there which are usually dealt with promptly and without resorting to any hysterics about "race wars".
It is mostly a hard-working aspirational community which tends to collectively solve our own problems.
But perhaps the biggest problem is those who try to exploit isolated incidents and attempt to agitate hatred within communities.
But they only seem to just get themselves all upset over their own rantings. Very few South Siders are daft enough to bite the troublemakers bait.
Perhaps that is because we are mainly a Chav-free zone? :)
Here in the South Side we have the most ethnically diverse population in Scotland.
Sure there are trouble spots here and there which are usually dealt with promptly and without resorting to any hysterics about "race wars".
It is mostly a hard-working aspirational community which tends to collectively solve our own problems.
But perhaps the biggest problem is those who try to exploit isolated incidents and attempt to agitate hatred within communities.
But they only seem to just get themselves all upset over their own rantings. Very few South Siders are daft enough to bite the troublemakers bait.
Perhaps that is because we are mainly a Chav-free zone? :)
Posted by: Riz, Govanhill on 5:27pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Branislav it upsets me that you have to read messages from some people on here who would make you feel not welcome. There are bad people on both sides and I hope that these people do not upset you too much.
All the very best of luck to you in my country, your country and OUR country.[bold]bold[/bold]
Branislav it upsets me that you have to read messages from some people on here who would make you feel not welcome. There are bad people on both sides and I hope that these people do not upset you too much.
All the very best of luck to you in my country, your country and OUR country.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 5:48pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Riz[/bold] wrote:
Branislav it upsets me that you have to read messages from some people on here who would make you feel not welcome. There are bad people on both sides and I hope that these people do not upset you too much.
All the very best of luck to you in my country, your country and OUR country.[bold]bold[/bold] [/quote] We are all economic units in an open border European Union.
People will come and go at the whim of conglomerates and corporations needs.
Not the way I would like it - just the way it is.
It isn't anyones country Riz - it is an open economic federation that has free movement of workers.
We have no responsibility to any economic migrant.
Didn't you all know that?
Riz wrote:
Branislav it upsets me that you have to read messages from some people on here who would make you feel not welcome. There are bad people on both sides and I hope that these people do not upset you too much.
All the very best of luck to you in my country, your country and OUR country.
We are all economic units in an open border European Union.
People will come and go at the whim of conglomerates and corporations needs.
Not the way I would like it - just the way it is.
It isn't anyones country Riz - it is an open economic federation that has free movement of workers.
We have no responsibility to any economic migrant.
Didn't you all know that?
Posted by: Branislav, Glasgow on 5:49pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Thank you Riz. You are kind.
Thank you Riz. You are kind.
Posted by: caledonian, Glasgow on 5:58pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Reminder to Fidelio, Gold Coast, Australia:-
Don’t forget the sectarianism and bigotry against Protestants.
Reminder to Fidelio, Gold Coast, Australia:-
Don’t forget the sectarianism and bigotry against Protestants.
Posted by: jimmy, glesga boy on 7:23pm Sat 17 Mar 07
stanis lav move in with that numpty riz, he will look after you take the rest doon to rosie ya bunch a bams were all getting took to the cleaners with this shower, race riots you meen the the ones in sydny au dec 06 lebs burning cars flags ect. reason they wanted their own beach so non muslims could not their woman bathing mr magoo mibees no me if ye live in closes yous bams i hope the manky mob all move in with you, next door to you. smashing. a bet not one of yees seen an angry german, we would all bee talking german if yous had.imigrants let wan in get 10 free. and im the mug paying for them. ya tubes.
stanis lav move in with that numpty riz, he will look after you take the rest doon to rosie ya bunch a bams were all getting took to the cleaners with this shower, race riots you meen the the ones in sydny au dec 06 lebs burning cars flags ect. reason they wanted their own beach so non muslims could not their woman bathing mr magoo mibees no me if ye live in closes yous bams i hope the manky mob all move in with you, next door to you. smashing. a bet not one of yees seen an angry german, we would all bee talking german if yous had.imigrants let wan in get 10 free. and im the mug paying for them. ya tubes.
Posted by: Boab, Glasgow on 8:11pm Sat 17 Mar 07
Where did you go to school Jimmy?
What language are you speaking?
God man, people like you give us a bad name here.
I hope you're proud of yourself.
You're an embarrassment pal.
Where did you go to school Jimmy?
What language are you speaking?
God man, people like you give us a bad name here.
I hope you're proud of yourself.
You're an embarrassment pal.
Posted by: Des on 9:17pm Sat 17 Mar 07
[quote][bold]lee[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Rob[/bold] wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...[/quote] Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)[/quote] A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.[/quote] Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers.....
lee wrote:
Des wrote:
Rob wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.
Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers.....
Posted by: scott, glasgow on 4:10am Sun 18 Mar 07
well done thomas i agree.
why dont we put these immigrants in the same suburbs as the politicians who bring them in .
anyone who complains on this post well move them in to your house to teach them our values and culture ( i dont think ).
1) they dont speak english and dont on doing so
2)they will all stay in the one area as not to
mingle with the scottish population.
3) they have no respect for the law.
4)they will not work as the social security have a department specialising in making sure they get every benefit that is going .
5)they will sell ANYTHING in the black market to get cash and avoid paying taxes like us.
6)there kids will rome the streets unsupervised with weapons just the way they do in there hometown.
look at the trouble that has been caused with other races being introduced into our society.
Let them move into the leafy suburbs of the politicians aqnd upper class and see how long they can stand it.
if anyone doubts the above just look what australia is going through at the moment with immigrants coming from lower moral countrys.
scotland was a thriving country that was turned into a holiday resort by the english now its a half way house for the dregs of the earth.
well done thomas i agree.
why dont we put these immigrants in the same suburbs as the politicians who bring them in .
anyone who complains on this post well move them in to your house to teach them our values and culture ( i dont think ).
1) they dont speak english and dont on doing so
2)they will all stay in the one area as not to
mingle with the scottish population.
3) they have no respect for the law.
4)they will not work as the social security have a department specialising in making sure they get every benefit that is going .
5)they will sell ANYTHING in the black market to get cash and avoid paying taxes like us.
6)there kids will rome the streets unsupervised with weapons just the way they do in there hometown.
look at the trouble that has been caused with other races being introduced into our society.
Let them move into the leafy suburbs of the politicians aqnd upper class and see how long they can stand it.
if anyone doubts the above just look what australia is going through at the moment with immigrants coming from lower moral countrys.
scotland was a thriving country that was turned into a holiday resort by the english now its a half way house for the dregs of the earth.
Posted by: Des on 8:23am Sun 18 Mar 07
Totally agree with you Thomas,trouble is if you voice those opinions you are accused of being racist..The PC brigade have stopped us saying what we feel,example,they now want to teach children as young as seven,yes seven about homosexuality..Now i dont want to digress but i want my children to be children,i also want the right to say what i want albeit without offending anyone but i am being denied this basic right by spineless politicians..Here is a thought,if everyone deserves a chance Rosie/Riz,then you wont mind if paedophiles recently released from prison are housed next door to you or is that a different matter??....
Totally agree with you Thomas,trouble is if you voice those opinions you are accused of being racist..The PC brigade have stopped us saying what we feel,example,they now want to teach children as young as seven,yes seven about homosexuality..Now i dont want to digress but i want my children to be children,i also want the right to say what i want albeit without offending anyone but i am being denied this basic right by spineless politicians..Here is a thought,if everyone deserves a chance Rosie/Riz,then you wont mind if paedophiles recently released from prison are housed next door to you or is that a different matter??....
Posted by: big cheque, london on 10:14am Sun 18 Mar 07
sanity at last. the last two postings spot on. i also agree with some of what jim said,what a funny guy. what is a boaby
sanity at last. the last two postings spot on. i also agree with some of what jim said,what a funny guy. what is a boaby
Posted by: arthur, Sydney on 1:04pm Sun 18 Mar 07
To Boab,Great Post;
However Jimmys facts were also an embarrassment.
The race riots he refers to here were a reaction to attacks made by hordes of drunken so called"Australian patriot" vigilantes chasing, cornering,then bashing anyone who looked "foreign" .Reason?
Intellectually similar Lebanese thugs muscling in on their territory,ie: the beach
I know it takes time for people to settle in and be accepted;When we arrived here we were ridiculed as being pommys, something that rankled even more as it grouped us with the dreaded English,but then the Yugoslavs arrived and the heat was off us suddenly.A few years later the heat came off them when boatloads of Vietnamese started arriving and lo and behold the new pests from abroad are those pesky Arabic speaking Lebanese with their women dressed with all the style of the grim reaper.
I wonder who will get them of the hook?
To Boab,Great Post;
However Jimmys facts were also an embarrassment.
The race riots he refers to here were a reaction to attacks made by hordes of drunken so called"Australian patriot" vigilantes chasing, cornering,then bashing anyone who looked "foreign" .Reason?
Intellectually similar Lebanese thugs muscling in on their territory,ie: the beach
I know it takes time for people to settle in and be accepted;When we arrived here we were ridiculed as being pommys, something that rankled even more as it grouped us with the dreaded English,but then the Yugoslavs arrived and the heat was off us suddenly.A few years later the heat came off them when boatloads of Vietnamese started arriving and lo and behold the new pests from abroad are those pesky Arabic speaking Lebanese with their women dressed with all the style of the grim reaper.
I wonder who will get them of the hook?
Posted by: raz, langside rd on 1:24pm Sun 18 Mar 07
I have lived in govanhill for nearly fifty years,i have seen many immigrant families come and go but these roma gypsies are the worst,they have set fire to my close,vandalised it time after time,could not give a **** about anybody,and that is only the kids.Adults and children hang at the corner of langside rd /allison st FROM MORNING TILL LATE AT NIGHT,frightening the local population,some of the young females are prostitutes trying to pick up clients.these gypsies have no scruples and it is time for the council and police to take action. we need to take action now before there are vigilante groups are formed against the gypsies
I have lived in govanhill for nearly fifty years,i have seen many immigrant families come and go but these roma gypsies are the worst,they have set fire to my close,vandalised it time after time,could not give a **** about anybody,and that is only the kids.Adults and children hang at the corner of langside rd /allison st FROM MORNING TILL LATE AT NIGHT,frightening the local population,some of the young females are prostitutes trying to pick up clients.these gypsies have no scruples and it is time for the council and police to take action. we need to take action now before there are vigilante groups are formed against the gypsies
Posted by: jimmy, glesga boy on 2:13pm Sun 18 Mar 07
facts embarrissment, dont think so hector, i was on crunella beach dec 06. lebs came down and intiminated aussie woman and teenagers for using a certain part of that beach where their woman were bathing fully clothed as well. they got a bit of slap for taking a liberty, then the lebs came back with weapons,they tanned a few rsl clubs stabbed a couple of ozzy guys burnt a few flags.see it soon this summer here in the uk.try reading yer papers. articals in the local papers referd to the aussie mobs as akin to english football hooligans, or are you one of that mob that support all thing foriegn
facts embarrissment, dont think so hector, i was on crunella beach dec 06. lebs came down and intiminated aussie woman and teenagers for using a certain part of that beach where their woman were bathing fully clothed as well. they got a bit of slap for taking a liberty, then the lebs came back with weapons,they tanned a few rsl clubs stabbed a couple of ozzy guys burnt a few flags.see it soon this summer here in the uk.try reading yer papers. articals in the local papers referd to the aussie mobs as akin to english football hooligans, or are you one of that mob that support all thing foriegn
Posted by: william mclachlan, glasgow east on 2:28pm Sun 18 Mar 07
our city cant cope with the open door policy that we have for asylum seekers , how many do we have in glasgow we will never find out as the home office cant give us a correct figure could you belive anything this government told you .
housing asylum seekers in our communities only gives them false hope and will bring more trouble to areas were each group want to take control .
glasgow is the asylum capital of the united kingdom we take more than the whole of wales and northern ireland its got to stop and stop now
our city cant cope with the open door policy that we have for asylum seekers , how many do we have in glasgow we will never find out as the home office cant give us a correct figure could you belive anything this government told you .
housing asylum seekers in our communities only gives them false hope and will bring more trouble to areas were each group want to take control .
glasgow is the asylum capital of the united kingdom we take more than the whole of wales and northern ireland its got to stop and stop now
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 4:27pm Sun 18 Mar 07
I think that racism is the result of social misfits targetting those who are different in order to compensate for their own inadequacies.
There is no other logical explanation for demonising an entire community because of the misdeeds amongst the few.
Thankfully the vast majority of South Siders of all creeds and colours have better morals than the tiny minority of feeble-minded agitiating racial hatred within our communities...
Perhaps these gibbering Chavs and Neds should giving ghettoes of their own, preferably on some remote Island far away from the more civilised scots? :)
I think that racism is the result of social misfits targetting those who are different in order to compensate for their own inadequacies.
There is no other logical explanation for demonising an entire community because of the misdeeds amongst the few.
Thankfully the vast majority of South Siders of all creeds and colours have better morals than the tiny minority of feeble-minded agitiating racial hatred within our communities...
Perhaps these gibbering Chavs and Neds should giving ghettoes of their own, preferably on some remote Island far away from the more civilised scots? :)
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 5:00pm Sun 18 Mar 07
One solution to all this would be another aspect of British life they may not have encountered yet - [bold]The Asbo[/bold] :)
One solution to all this would be another aspect of British life they may not have encountered yet -
The Asbo :)
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 5:04pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
I think that racism is the result of social misfits targetting those who are different in order to compensate for their own inadequacies.
There is no other logical explanation for demonising an entire community because of the misdeeds amongst the few.
Thankfully the vast majority of South Siders of all creeds and colours have better morals than the tiny minority of feeble-minded agitiating racial hatred within our communities...
Perhaps these gibbering Chavs and Neds should giving ghettoes of their own, preferably on some remote Island far away from the more civilised scots? :)
[/quote] And who do you think you are speaking for?
The vast majority of South-Siders???
Don't be silly.
I don't remember voting for you.
Tell you what Ally - why don't you organise a partial referendum - a sample of 3 thousand from the South Side (those on the electoral register)
Ask a neutral question about the rate and amount of immigration.
You will then have a measurable answer to the wishes of the people of the South Side.
----
I notice that you are reduced to making meaningless personal insults.
Why don't you actually answer the many real and valid points that have been made by contributors to this thread.
You haven't as yet.
Ally Cain wrote:
I think that racism is the result of social misfits targetting those who are different in order to compensate for their own inadequacies.
There is no other logical explanation for demonising an entire community because of the misdeeds amongst the few.
Thankfully the vast majority of South Siders of all creeds and colours have better morals than the tiny minority of feeble-minded agitiating racial hatred within our communities...
Perhaps these gibbering Chavs and Neds should giving ghettoes of their own, preferably on some remote Island far away from the more civilised scots? :)
And who do you think you are speaking for?
The vast majority of South-Siders???
Don't be silly.
I don't remember voting for you.
Tell you what Ally - why don't you organise a partial referendum - a sample of 3 thousand from the South Side (those on the electoral register)
Ask a neutral question about the rate and amount of immigration.
You will then have a measurable answer to the wishes of the people of the South Side.
----
I notice that you are reduced to making meaningless personal insults.
Why don't you actually answer the many real and valid points that have been made by contributors to this thread.
You haven't as yet.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 5:12pm Sun 18 Mar 07
Perhaps Ally Cain,you tree hugging,rose tinted spec wearing,gypo lover,we should move them next door to you..For years your ilk have played the race card if someone dared to disagree with you..I am university educated & i would rather have the so called neds like the ones who came to my mothers rescue on Friday night living next door to me than clowns like you..As for the good south siders,most of the ones i have spoken to are in agreement with views aired on this "forum"..My father & uncles fought in a war so that we could speak our minds freely without fear & you & your kind would take that from us if we people didnt have the guts to speak out for what they believe,Racism?,no OUR RIGHT....
Perhaps Ally Cain,you tree hugging,rose tinted spec wearing,gypo lover,we should move them next door to you..For years your ilk have played the race card if someone dared to disagree with you..I am university educated & i would rather have the so called neds like the ones who came to my mothers rescue on Friday night living next door to me than clowns like you..As for the good south siders,most of the ones i have spoken to are in agreement with views aired on this "forum"..My father & uncles fought in a war so that we could speak our minds freely without fear & you & your kind would take that from us if we people didnt have the guts to speak out for what they believe,Racism?,no OUR RIGHT....
Posted by: Lee on 7:34pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lee[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Rob[/bold] wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...[/quote] Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)[/quote] A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.[/quote] Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers..... [/quote] Des, am no naive pal I understand there is a problem and that something has to done about it. Its up to the people affected by these gypos to make our voices heard in order for something to get done about it. Describing it as 'there is a race war coming' is just pie in the sky mate.Violence isnae the answer and how many people do you think would actually take part in that? Would you? Have you ever been in a war zone? Coz a have. Its quite rich hearin bullsh*t like that comin from someone who is planning to pi*s off to Australia. They have the same social problems with these sorts of people as we do. See ye later. A hope a shark bites yer leg aff when ye get there.
Des wrote:
lee wrote: Des wrote: Rob wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.
Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers.....
Des, am no naive pal I understand there is a problem and that something has to done about it. Its up to the people affected by these gypos to make our voices heard in order for something to get done about it. Describing it as 'there is a race war coming' is just pie in the sky mate.Violence isnae the answer and how many people do you think would actually take part in that? Would you? Have you ever been in a war zone? Coz a have. Its quite rich hearin bullsh*t like that comin from someone who is planning to pi*s off to Australia. They have the same social problems with these sorts of people as we do. See ye later. A hope a shark bites yer leg aff when ye get there.
Posted by: Ally Cain on 7:41pm Sun 18 Mar 07
As I've lived all my life in the south side I think like everbody else im entitled to express an opnion based on that experience.
It isn't really my problem if the racist neds are outraged by the idea that some of us Scots stick to the game plan of punishing the guilty (severely we hope) but leaving the innocents well alone.
And thats the way it has always been, despite the minority of neds agitiating "vigilanties" or "race wars" againts entire communities just because a few foreign kids **** in their street.:)
[bold]If you don't like the idea of severe justice being imposed only upon the guilty then why not do what you are suggesting for some of the South Side community ie; beat it, go away, leave the country?[/bold]
Don't let the door bang your heads on the way out. :)
As I've lived all my life in the south side I think like everbody else im entitled to express an opnion based on that experience.
It isn't really my problem if the racist neds are outraged by the idea that some of us Scots stick to the game plan of punishing the guilty (severely we hope) but leaving the innocents well alone.
And thats the way it has always been, despite the minority of neds agitiating "vigilanties" or "race wars" againts entire communities just because a few foreign kids **** in their street.:)
If you don't like the idea of severe justice being imposed only upon the guilty then why not do what you are suggesting for some of the South Side community ie; beat it, go away, leave the country?
Don't let the door bang your heads on the way out. :)
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 7:56pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
As I\'ve lived all my life in the south side I think like everbody else im entitled to express an opnion based on that experience.
It isn\'t really my problem if the racist neds are outraged by the idea that some of us Scots stick to the game plan of punishing the guilty (severely we hope) but leaving the innocents well alone.
And thats the way it has always been, despite the minority of neds agitiating \"vigilanties\" or \"race wars\" againts entire communities just because a few foreign kids **** in their street.:)
[bold]If you don\'t like the idea of severe justice being imposed only upon the guilty then why not do what you are suggesting for some of the South Side community ie; beat it, go away, leave the country?[/bold]
Don\'t let the door bang your heads on the way out. :)
[/quote] "Express my opinion based on that experience"
Indeed - you mean the same thing you are denying everyone else who disagrees with you.
Guilty? - innocent?
Have you actually raed most of the posts on this thread?
Govanhill residents are concerned that we are the dumping ground for rejects from Slovakia - as has been stated several times here
the Slovakian govenment has paid many of the Roma (or if you prefer 'Gypsies') to leave that country and not come back.
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
Try doing some research on the subject - all your emotive nonsense is not at all relevant.
"If you don't like the idea of severe justice being imposed only on the guilty" - what in the name of god are you talking about???
"Leave the country" you say - what country? We are part of an open border European union - we are only worth the skills we have to sell.
That is how it works - if the migrants skill are not wanted or needed then what use are they??
If economic migrants like these Roma are paid to leave their homeland and come here because they are a profound social curse to Slovakia.
Why are you bringing in all these extraneous points?
Again I say to you Ally answer the many valid points made in this thread - you are begining to sound really desperate.
Ally Cain wrote:
As I\'ve lived all my life in the south side I think like everbody else im entitled to express an opnion based on that experience.
It isn\'t really my problem if the racist neds are outraged by the idea that some of us Scots stick to the game plan of punishing the guilty (severely we hope) but leaving the innocents well alone.
And thats the way it has always been, despite the minority of neds agitiating \"vigilanties\" or \"race wars\" againts entire communities just because a few foreign kids **** in their street.:)
If you don\'t like the idea of severe justice being imposed only upon the guilty then why not do what you are suggesting for some of the South Side community ie; beat it, go away, leave the country?
Don\'t let the door bang your heads on the way out. :)
"Express my opinion based on that experience"
Indeed - you mean the same thing you are denying everyone else who disagrees with you.
Guilty? - innocent?
Have you actually raed most of the posts on this thread?
Govanhill residents are concerned that we are the dumping ground for rejects from Slovakia - as has been stated several times here
the Slovakian govenment has paid many of the Roma (or if you prefer 'Gypsies') to leave that country and not come back.
http://www.workpermit.com/news/2005_06_16/europe/slovakia_helps_unemployed.htm
Try doing some research on the subject - all your emotive nonsense is not at all relevant.
"If you don't like the idea of severe justice being imposed only on the guilty" - what in the name of god are you talking about???
"Leave the country" you say - what country? We are part of an open border European union - we are only worth the skills we have to sell.
That is how it works - if the migrants skill are not wanted or needed then what use are they??
If economic migrants like these Roma are paid to leave their homeland and come here because they are a profound social curse to Slovakia.
Why are you bringing in all these extraneous points?
Again I say to you Ally answer the many valid points made in this thread - you are begining to sound really desperate.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:22pm Sun 18 Mar 07
Lets not forget the Czechs in all this - they are keen to off load their social problems onto Britain.
If you don't have a good memory for numbers, you need to remember just one figure - eighty percent.
More than 80% of adult Roma are jobless, the chances that a Roma child, aged six, will be sent to a special elementary school for retarded students are about 80%, more than 80% of all prosecuted and convicted perpetrators of criminal felonies are Roma.
Few speak any English - few have any skills - as economic migrants they are utterly useless.
Market forces should dictate their fate.
I know it is utterly heartless - but it is the simple economic fact of how they come to have suddenly turned up here.
If they are given additional assistance it is doing an enormous disservice to the thousands of highly skilled and able people from Eastern Europe (include the lovely countries that are the Slovak and Czech republics) educated and intelligent people with skills to offer and a huge contribution to make to our communities - enriching their own lives as well.
The Roma from the Slovakia/Czech region are not are persecuted minority - they are in now way entitled to asylum. Slovak/Czech republics are advanced European nations. They have much in common with Scotland but why don't they deal with their own social problems - why has it suddenly become Govanhill's problem?
I mean for Gods sake don't we have enough social problems of our own!!!
Lets not forget the Czechs in all this - they are keen to off load their social problems onto Britain.
If you don't have a good memory for numbers, you need to remember just one figure - eighty percent.
More than 80% of adult Roma are jobless, the chances that a Roma child, aged six, will be sent to a special elementary school for retarded students are about 80%, more than 80% of all prosecuted and convicted perpetrators of criminal felonies are Roma.
Few speak any English - few have any skills - as economic migrants they are utterly useless.
Market forces should dictate their fate.
I know it is utterly heartless - but it is the simple economic fact of how they come to have suddenly turned up here.
If they are given additional assistance it is doing an enormous disservice to the thousands of highly skilled and able people from Eastern Europe (include the lovely countries that are the Slovak and Czech republics) educated and intelligent people with skills to offer and a huge contribution to make to our communities - enriching their own lives as well.
The Roma from the Slovakia/Czech region are not are persecuted minority - they are in now way entitled to asylum. Slovak/Czech republics are advanced European nations. They have much in common with Scotland but why don't they deal with their own social problems - why has it suddenly become Govanhill's problem?
I mean for Gods sake don't we have enough social problems of our own!!!
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 8:24pm Sun 18 Mar 07
The points are related to the Evening Times article Thomas, and the blame-one-blame-all mentality of some of the air-heads on here.
You know the kind of folks Thomas, those who say no one has a right to disagree with you unless you voted for them eh? :)
Anyway it isnt anyone elsesa problem if you are deliberaltey pulling attention from the actual article and some of the more odious racicsts comments here is it?
Done any research on the history of the British people yet Thomas, or are you just happy to keep on opening your mouth and just letting your belly rumble?
I don't need to answer any of your "points", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance of British history.
Laugh?
I nearly bought a round!
The points are related to the Evening Times article Thomas, and the blame-one-blame-all mentality of some of the air-heads on here.
You know the kind of folks Thomas, those who say no one has a right to disagree with you unless you voted for them eh? :)
Anyway it isnt anyone elsesa problem if you are deliberaltey pulling attention from the actual article and some of the more odious racicsts comments here is it?
Done any research on the history of the British people yet Thomas, or are you just happy to keep on opening your mouth and just letting your belly rumble?
I don't need to answer any of your "points", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance of British history.
Laugh?
I nearly bought a round!
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:31pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
The points are related to the Evening Times article Thomas, and the blame-one-blame-all mentality of some of the air-heads on here.
You know the kind of folks Thomas, those who say no one has a right to disagree with you unless you voted for them eh? :)
Anyway it isnt anyone elsesa problem if you are deliberaltey pulling attention from the actual article and some of the more odious racicsts comments here is it?
Done any research on the history of the British people yet Thomas, or are you just happy to keep on opening your mouth and just letting your belly rumble?
I don\'t need to answer any of your \"points\", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance of British history.
Laugh?
I nearly bought a round!
[/quote] Ally - your personal comments are childish.
I have answered all your points on your simplistic view of British History (of which I need no lessons from you) - try reading there thread.
You are the one distracting from the Evening Times article.
The focus of which is the Roma - who they are, how they came to be here.
It will be obvious to anyone reading this thread who is letting their belly rumble.
It is all about economics Ally.
You are just a tiny cog in the machine - making your outdated reactionary comments.
If economic migrants don't function (or in the case of the Roma have been dumped here by their governments) they mess things up for the real economic migrants.
Ally Cain wrote:
The points are related to the Evening Times article Thomas, and the blame-one-blame-all mentality of some of the air-heads on here.
You know the kind of folks Thomas, those who say no one has a right to disagree with you unless you voted for them eh? :)
Anyway it isnt anyone elsesa problem if you are deliberaltey pulling attention from the actual article and some of the more odious racicsts comments here is it?
Done any research on the history of the British people yet Thomas, or are you just happy to keep on opening your mouth and just letting your belly rumble?
I don\'t need to answer any of your \"points\", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance of British history.
Laugh?
I nearly bought a round!
Ally - your personal comments are childish.
I have answered all your points on your simplistic view of British History (of which I need no lessons from you) - try reading there thread.
You are the one distracting from the Evening Times article.
The focus of which is the Roma - who they are, how they came to be here.
It will be obvious to anyone reading this thread who is letting their belly rumble.
It is all about economics Ally.
You are just a tiny cog in the machine - making your outdated reactionary comments.
If economic migrants don't function (or in the case of the Roma have been dumped here by their governments) they mess things up for the real economic migrants.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:39pm Sun 18 Mar 07
Ally - "I don't need to answer any of your "points", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance"
Your form of argument is rather innadequate....
I mean a personal attack and a repeat of the same "British History" debate. (read the thread mate - I can't be bothered typing it all again.
I am not worried by your abuse. It simply means you have nothing to say and to be perfectly frank you are really boring me.
Ally - "I don't need to answer any of your "points", it is much more fun just reading your phoney outrage and pompous ignorance"
Your form of argument is rather innadequate....
I mean a personal attack and a repeat of the same "British History" debate. (read the thread mate - I can't be bothered typing it all again.
I am not worried by your abuse. It simply means you have nothing to say and to be perfectly frank you are really boring me.
Posted by: arthur, Sydney on 8:54pm Sun 18 Mar 07
Dear Jimmy,Your version of events at Cronulla beach to justify your blatent xenophobia is at odds with reality.
This is how Sydneys only quality broadsheet covered the riot.see
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/mob-violence-envelops-cronulla/2005/12/11/1134235936223.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap2
I dont believe you were there Sunny Jim!
Dear Jimmy,Your version of events at Cronulla beach to justify your blatent xenophobia is at odds with reality.
This is how Sydneys only quality broadsheet covered the riot.see
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/mob-violence-envelops-cronulla/2005/12/11/1134235936223.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap2
I dont believe you were there Sunny Jim!
Posted by: Des on 9:22pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Lee[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lee[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Rob[/bold] wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...[/quote] Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)[/quote] A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.[/quote] Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers..... [/quote] Des, am no naive pal I understand there is a problem and that something has to done about it. Its up to the people affected by these gypos to make our voices heard in order for something to get done about it. Describing it as \'there is a race war coming\' is just pie in the sky mate.Violence isnae the answer and how many people do you think would actually take part in that? Would you? Have you ever been in a war zone? Coz a have. Its quite rich hearin bullsh*t like that comin from someone who is planning to pi*s off to Australia. They have the same social problems with these sorts of people as we do. See ye later. A hope a shark bites yer leg aff when ye get there.[/quote] Lee i was in Bosnia/Serbia & Iraq,iv seen what war does & the suffering that it brings to countries..In answer to your question no i wouldnt take part in a race war,i hate violence,i have seen enough of it to last me a life time..Im going to Australia for a better life for my family & I because i am taxed to the hilt in this country for being successful & hard working..I am a 2nd class citizen in the country of my birth,hampered by politicians who line their own pockets while passing inane laws to suit their political leanings that week/month..I apologize Lee for calling you naive as you obviously have seen some pretty bad stuff like myself,i do stand by my statement though that a race war is looming..PS I will keep an eye out for sharks,human & otherwise...
Lee wrote:
Des wrote:
lee wrote: Des wrote: Rob wrote: Des, you will love Australia but you will never escape narrow-mindedness. It exists here as much as it does in Glasgow. You are an economic migrant to Australia - where your pound will be worth a good pile of our Australian dollars...
Well okay i an economic migrant,iv been out to Aus for 3month stays so im not going there with rose tinted socialist specs on & i know that narrow minded bigots are everywhere..Im sad to be leaving but Jack & company leave me no choice,there are barriers everywhere i turn,i am becoming a second class citizen in the country of my birth..A race war is coming & the powers that be are either to blind or to stupid to see it..So il say G,day & be thinking of you all when im sitting on my boat on the swan river in Perth(Australia that is)
A race WAR is coming? Aye right mate, what like WW2? ad luv to know what you think is goin to happen thats pure Hollywood.
Lee you really are naive if you think it is pure Hollywood,people are fed up being treated as 2nd class & seeing their tax dollars being spent on asylum seekers,economic migrants etc..Yes im going to be an economic migrant,but as i have pointed out i am not taking a cent from the Australian Govt..Just because i dont sgree with the wishy washy liberals does not make me a racist..This country should sort out its problems before sorting out other countries problems,monies that should be used to help the elderly,education,the nhs is being diverted to incomers.....
Des, am no naive pal I understand there is a problem and that something has to done about it. Its up to the people affected by these gypos to make our voices heard in order for something to get done about it. Describing it as \'there is a race war coming\' is just pie in the sky mate.Violence isnae the answer and how many people do you think would actually take part in that? Would you? Have you ever been in a war zone? Coz a have. Its quite rich hearin bullsh*t like that comin from someone who is planning to pi*s off to Australia. They have the same social problems with these sorts of people as we do. See ye later. A hope a shark bites yer leg aff when ye get there.
Lee i was in Bosnia/Serbia & Iraq,iv seen what war does & the suffering that it brings to countries..In answer to your question no i wouldnt take part in a race war,i hate violence,i have seen enough of it to last me a life time..Im going to Australia for a better life for my family & I because i am taxed to the hilt in this country for being successful & hard working..I am a 2nd class citizen in the country of my birth,hampered by politicians who line their own pockets while passing inane laws to suit their political leanings that week/month..I apologize Lee for calling you naive as you obviously have seen some pretty bad stuff like myself,i do stand by my statement though that a race war is looming..PS I will keep an eye out for sharks,human & otherwise...
Posted by: william glasgoweast, 402-865 on 10:00pm Sun 18 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Kenny S[/bold] wrote:
It\'s time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education. It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.[/quote] i think kenny s could be right that the bnp could get an msp elected in glasgow as the people of glasgow are fed up being used as a dumping ground , we take in more asylum seekers than the whole of wales and northern ireland put together
Kenny S wrote:
It\'s time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education. It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.
i think kenny s could be right that the bnp could get an msp elected in glasgow as the people of glasgow are fed up being used as a dumping ground , we take in more asylum seekers than the whole of wales and northern ireland put together
Posted by: jimmy, glesga boy on 8:46am Mon 19 Mar 07
how come my posts keep getting removed, yet the ones against me stay on. let me tell ye the pc brigade, if it dont suit them to bad. rosie riz dug branislav. and stupit arse arthur, shove this times up yer jacksy along with all yer eastern european chums.ya bunch a boabys. ya bass.
how come my posts keep getting removed, yet the ones against me stay on. let me tell ye the pc brigade, if it dont suit them to bad. rosie riz dug branislav. and stupit arse arthur, shove this times up yer jacksy along with all yer eastern european chums.ya bunch a boabys. ya bass.
Posted by: Greg Paton, Bishopbriggs on 8:47am Mon 19 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Thomas[/bold] wrote:
There has been a profound change in Govanhill in the last couple of years. The racial mix has changed with a very large number of economic migrants from other parts of the EU - as well as a smattering of refugees from various parts of the world. All seem temporary and all seem suspicious and hostile to the host Scottish population. There has been a large Asian population in the South Side of Glasgow - who in my opinion are a very insular group who have little or nothing in common with the Scottish population. Even after a couple of generations they want to remain estranged. Wearing costumes from a different culture. Indeed when asked they will always describe themselves as Pakistani (etc.) Many Asian teenagers have their own distinct accent - a sure sign that they spend little time with and have no allegiance to the general population of Scots. In my opinion there are far too many people in the South Side of Glasgow who owe no allegiance to and care little about Scotland - and after all why should they. We have been told for years that we live in a multi-cultural society. The fruits of that is the establishment of small pockets of foreigners in our midst for the forseeable future - perhaps generations. What I think is the biggest worry and extreme frustration to the Scottish population WE WERE NEVER ASKED!!![/quote] I very much agree with pretty much everything yo have said and therefore there is no need for me to post a note . Well done !
Greg.
Thomas wrote:
There has been a profound change in Govanhill in the last couple of years. The racial mix has changed with a very large number of economic migrants from other parts of the EU - as well as a smattering of refugees from various parts of the world. All seem temporary and all seem suspicious and hostile to the host Scottish population. There has been a large Asian population in the South Side of Glasgow - who in my opinion are a very insular group who have little or nothing in common with the Scottish population. Even after a couple of generations they want to remain estranged. Wearing costumes from a different culture. Indeed when asked they will always describe themselves as Pakistani (etc.) Many Asian teenagers have their own distinct accent - a sure sign that they spend little time with and have no allegiance to the general population of Scots. In my opinion there are far too many people in the South Side of Glasgow who owe no allegiance to and care little about Scotland - and after all why should they. We have been told for years that we live in a multi-cultural society. The fruits of that is the establishment of small pockets of foreigners in our midst for the forseeable future - perhaps generations. What I think is the biggest worry and extreme frustration to the Scottish population WE WERE NEVER ASKED!!!
I very much agree with pretty much everything yo have said and therefore there is no need for me to post a note . Well done !
Greg.
Posted by: Andy, Greenock on 9:05am Mon 19 Mar 07
What I don't get is everyone puts this down as racism.
but if these refugees do the exact same as British Citizens then it gets a sugary sweet coating over it, oh they were acting out of self defense or they were having a really rough time because of so and so, never mind the fact that they were also acting like thugs.
This attitude increases racism and rasicm related crime because everyone is sick of double standards.
What I don't get is everyone puts this down as racism.
but if these refugees do the exact same as British Citizens then it gets a sugary sweet coating over it, oh they were acting out of self defense or they were having a really rough time because of so and so, never mind the fact that they were also acting like thugs.
This attitude increases racism and rasicm related crime because everyone is sick of double standards.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 11:55am Mon 19 Mar 07
[quote][bold]william glasgoweast[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Kenny S[/bold] wrote:
It\\\'s time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education. It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.[/quote] i think kenny s could be right that the bnp could get an msp elected in glasgow as the people of glasgow are fed up being used as a dumping ground , we take in more asylum seekers than the whole of wales and northern ireland put together [/quote] As a life time Labour voter and trade unionist I never I would say this but I agree with Kenny S - I would not be surprised if there is a BNP MSP elected in Glasgow on the regional list.
We are being led down the garden path by bumbling fools (our elected Labour officials) - I have worked with them for years I know exactly what they are like - I am sure everyone reading this is sick of the same old inarticulate idiots being taken out of the cupboard by Labour every election.
I have not decided how to cast my second vote at the elections on May 3rd - I am sorely torn over it. I am just an ordinary retired Govanhill resident.
I am no radical and no troublemaker.
Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?
william glasgoweast wrote:
Kenny S wrote:
It's time voters rejected Labour and those who continue to advocate open borders and mass econmic migration. Scottish people are being squeezed out of jobs, housing, health care and education. It is no wonder the BNP expect to get an MSP elected on the Glasgow Regional List on May the 3rd.
i think kenny s could be right that the bnp could get an msp elected in glasgow as the people of glasgow are fed up being used as a dumping ground , we take in more asylum seekers than the whole of wales and northern ireland put together
As a life time Labour voter and trade unionist I never I would say this but I agree with Kenny S - I would not be surprised if there is a BNP MSP elected in Glasgow on the regional list.
We are being led down the garden path by bumbling fools (our elected Labour officials) - I have worked with them for years I know exactly what they are like - I am sure everyone reading this is sick of the same old inarticulate idiots being taken out of the cupboard by Labour every election.
I have not decided how to cast my second vote at the elections on May 3rd - I am sorely torn over it. I am just an ordinary retired Govanhill resident.
I am no radical and no troublemaker.
Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?
Posted by: Des, Battlefield,well Newlands actually but there is a border dispute with some of the locals on 1:20pm Mon 19 Mar 07
I meant to say to all those who were berating me for moving to Oz & having the audacity to post on here,even though it wasnt actually said in those words..I am still keeping a 4 bedroom house in Glasgow which i WONT BE RENTING OUT & continuing to pay tax/council tax & all other stealth taxes in this country giving me the right to vote..I intend to live here for 3-4 months a year so i hope that leaves you all with a warm fuzzy feeling inside,cos it does for me.................
I meant to say to all those who were berating me for moving to Oz & having the audacity to post on here,even though it wasnt actually said in those words..I am still keeping a 4 bedroom house in Glasgow which i WONT BE RENTING OUT & continuing to pay tax/council tax & all other stealth taxes in this country giving me the right to vote..I intend to live here for 3-4 months a year so i hope that leaves you all with a warm fuzzy feeling inside,cos it does for me.................
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 5:33pm Mon 19 Mar 07
"Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?"
I wouldn't go that far.
But, I'll never vote Labour again, in any election. Especially not with complete slimeball numpties like Blair, McConnell and Purcell in charge.
"Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?"
I wouldn't go that far.
But, I'll never vote Labour again, in any election. Especially not with complete slimeball numpties like Blair, McConnell and Purcell in charge.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 5:45pm Mon 19 Mar 07
Thing is who are you left with?,..TheL ib-Dems are just Tories in cheaper suits & Annabel Goldie is a man in drag..Totally agree with you with regard to Labour,& the BNP is just not an option for me,so again who do we turn to..Salmond & Sturgeon(or seaweed as she is known in political circles because even the tide wont take her out) want to open the doors to all comers as they say we have a population crisis..
Thing is who are you left with?,..TheL ib-Dems are just Tories in cheaper suits & Annabel Goldie is a man in drag..Totally agree with you with regard to Labour,& the BNP is just not an option for me,so again who do we turn to..Salmond & Sturgeon(or seaweed as she is known in political circles because even the tide wont take her out) want to open the doors to all comers as they say we have a population crisis..
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 8:37pm Mon 19 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Mary Dole[/bold] wrote:
"Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?"
I wouldn't go that far.
But, I'll never vote Labour again, in any election. Especially not with complete slimeball numpties like Blair, McConnell and Purcell in charge.
[/quote] Well the BNP would not be getting my first vote - but we now have PR so they might get my second vote
Mary Dole wrote:
"Can anyone convince me not to vote BNP?"
I wouldn't go that far.
But, I'll never vote Labour again, in any election. Especially not with complete slimeball numpties like Blair, McConnell and Purcell in charge.
Well the BNP would not be getting my first vote - but we now have PR so they might get my second vote
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 9:08pm Mon 19 Mar 07
As the BNP is an openly Natzi Party they have no place in civilised society never mind Scotland.
They appeal only to the racist Idiot Savante that infests every community, thankfully 99.9% of Brits are not that socially retarded and never will be.
Never had an elected representatiive in Scotland., Wales or Northern Ireland in their entire existance so why do they persist in calling themselves "[bold]British[/bold] Nationalists"?
As the BNP is an openly Natzi Party they have no place in civilised society never mind Scotland.
They appeal only to the racist Idiot Savante that infests every community, thankfully 99.9% of Brits are not that socially retarded and never will be.
Never had an elected representatiive in Scotland., Wales or Northern Ireland in their entire existance so why do they persist in calling themselves "
British Nationalists"?
Posted by: Mary Dole, Glasgow on 9:15pm Mon 19 Mar 07
"Thing is who are you left with?,.."
Aye there's the rub.
So, in no particular order, here's what I think:
Tories - Nah!
Lib Dems - Who's their leader now? Nah!
SNP - I could vote for them. Just.
Green - Maybe.
SSP/Solidarity - Nah! They've blown it.
Oh, and Ally, even an idiot savant might know that there is no 't' in [italic]Nazi[/italic] .
"Thing is who are you left with?,.."
Aye there's the rub.
So, in no particular order, here's what I think:
Tories - Nah!
Lib Dems - Who's their leader now? Nah!
SNP - I could vote for them. Just.
Green - Maybe.
SSP/Solidarity - Nah! They've blown it.
Oh, and Ally, even an idiot savant might know that there is no 't' in
Nazi .
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 9:25pm Mon 19 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
Thing is who are you left with?,..TheL ib-Dems are just Tories in cheaper suits & Annabel Goldie is a man in drag..Totally agree with you with regard to Labour,& the BNP is just not an option for me,so again who do we turn to..Salmond & Sturgeon(or seaweed as she is known in political circles because even the tide wont take her out) want to open the doors to all comers as they say we have a population crisis..[/quote] You are right Des - I don't see any options either.
Like I said earlier - as a life time Labour voter and trade unionist I never thought I would say this but I would not be surprised if there is a BNP MSP elected in Glasgow on the regional list.
Such is the frustration at the numpties who refuse to even acknowledge peoples thoughts and wishes.
I always thought representitive democracy was suposed to reflect peopels wishes and thoughts - the peoples will. Obviously not.
Isn't is a disgrace that every "grand Plan" has been discredited - "monetarism", "multi-culturalism" etc. the goons we have had in power have not the slightest idea what they are doing.
With Proportional representation we have a chance to have a real refection of what people actualy want - and I for one will be voting with my true feelings.
Des wrote:
Thing is who are you left with?,..TheL ib-Dems are just Tories in cheaper suits & Annabel Goldie is a man in drag..Totally agree with you with regard to Labour,& the BNP is just not an option for me,so again who do we turn to..Salmond & Sturgeon(or seaweed as she is known in political circles because even the tide wont take her out) want to open the doors to all comers as they say we have a population crisis..
You are right Des - I don't see any options either.
Like I said earlier - as a life time Labour voter and trade unionist I never thought I would say this but I would not be surprised if there is a BNP MSP elected in Glasgow on the regional list.
Such is the frustration at the numpties who refuse to even acknowledge peoples thoughts and wishes.
I always thought representitive democracy was suposed to reflect peopels wishes and thoughts - the peoples will. Obviously not.
Isn't is a disgrace that every "grand Plan" has been discredited - "monetarism", "multi-culturalism" etc. the goons we have had in power have not the slightest idea what they are doing.
With Proportional representation we have a chance to have a real refection of what people actualy want - and I for one will be voting with my true feelings.
Posted by: Ally Cain, Battlefield on 9:42pm Mon 19 Mar 07
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 9:49pm Mon 19 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Mary Dole[/bold] wrote:
"Thing is who are you left with?,.."
Aye there's the rub.
So, in no particular order, here's what I think:
Tories - Nah!
Lib Dems - Who's their leader now? Nah!
SNP - I could vote for them. Just.
Green - Maybe.
SSP/Solidarity - Nah! They've blown it.
Oh, and Ally, even an idiot savant might know that there is no 't' in [italic]Nazi[/italic] .[/quote] I have to agree with your run down.
SNP - Maybe
Green - Maybe
SSP/Solidrity - voted for them last time as was really disappointed in their stupidity.
Tory/Lib-Dem - No
Last time I was SNP 1st vote - Green 2nd vote
I have not made any final decision for how I will go this time
Mary Dole wrote:
"Thing is who are you left with?,.."
Aye there's the rub.
So, in no particular order, here's what I think:
Tories - Nah!
Lib Dems - Who's their leader now? Nah!
SNP - I could vote for them. Just.
Green - Maybe.
SSP/Solidarity - Nah! They've blown it.
Oh, and Ally, even an idiot savant might know that there is no 't' in Nazi .
I have to agree with your run down.
SNP - Maybe
Green - Maybe
SSP/Solidrity - voted for them last time as was really disappointed in their stupidity.
Tory/Lib-Dem - No
Last time I was SNP 1st vote - Green 2nd vote
I have not made any final decision for how I will go this time
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 10:03am Tue 20 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)[/quote] Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..
Ally Cain wrote:
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 10:13am Tue 20 Mar 07
THE UK government will hold back more than £400m of benefits currently coming to Scotland if a future SNP government presses ahead with the reform of the council tax, Scotland on Sunday can reveal.
In what triggered a bitter constitutional row last night, Whitehall officials said Scotland would lose out on the UK cash if the Nationalists insisted on creating a new local income tax - a key plank of Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon's election strategy.
Instead, Labour said the funds would have to be found from their own £30bn budget, which is used to pay for Scotland's schools, hospitals and public services.
The funds in question currently flow to Scotland as council tax benefit - the rebate offered by the Department for Work and Pensions to help poorer householders with their bills.
By scrapping the council tax, this benefit would also be cancelled. The Nationalists are banking on an equivalent sum being transferred to Scotland to help offset the cost of their new tax.
However, Whitehall sources have now declared that the funds would be kept in Whitehall, leaving the SNP with a huge black hole in its finances.
A well-placed insider at the Department for Work and Pensions said: "We think the idea is risible. Council tax benefit is a national benefit and there is no automatic right of transfer to something else, whatsoever it is. You would have to start from the assumption that you would not get this money."
Scotland on Sunday has also obtained a leaked Scottish Executive briefing document, sent to finance minister Tom McCabe, which shows that ministers in Edinburgh have accepted that the cash will not be heading north.
The document, written by one of McCabe's officials, declares: "From experience with other policy areas we know that we would be unlikely to get this money back from Treasury and would have to make up the shortfall from Scottish Executive funding."
The document adds: "If in Scotland the council tax were replaced by a local income tax, council tax benefit would cease."
The precedent for the case being used by Executive officials is the row over the introduction of free personal care in Scotland in 2001. The introduction of the new right cancelled out another benefit, attendance allowance - worth £25m a year to Scotland. Despite lobbying from the Scottish Executive then, the money saved did not come north.
However, the Nationalists hit back last night, disputing the claims and accusing Labour of scare-mongering about the cost of their proposals. A spokesman said: "Labour is deliberately trying to scare people off about the cost of this as it tries to continue its defence of the unfair council tax. We have raised this issue with the DWP and with the Scottish Executive and we have never been told this is the case."
They said they would continue to pursue Whitehall over the matter. Nevertheless, the dispute will be damaging to their hopes of showing that the local income tax plan is financially viable.
This is a reality not just rhetoric...........
THE UK government will hold back more than £400m of benefits currently coming to Scotland if a future SNP government presses ahead with the reform of the council tax, Scotland on Sunday can reveal.
In what triggered a bitter constitutional row last night, Whitehall officials said Scotland would lose out on the UK cash if the Nationalists insisted on creating a new local income tax - a key plank of Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon's election strategy.
Instead, Labour said the funds would have to be found from their own £30bn budget, which is used to pay for Scotland's schools, hospitals and public services.
The funds in question currently flow to Scotland as council tax benefit - the rebate offered by the Department for Work and Pensions to help poorer householders with their bills.
By scrapping the council tax, this benefit would also be cancelled. The Nationalists are banking on an equivalent sum being transferred to Scotland to help offset the cost of their new tax.
However, Whitehall sources have now declared that the funds would be kept in Whitehall, leaving the SNP with a huge black hole in its finances.
A well-placed insider at the Department for Work and Pensions said: "We think the idea is risible. Council tax benefit is a national benefit and there is no automatic right of transfer to something else, whatsoever it is. You would have to start from the assumption that you would not get this money."
Scotland on Sunday has also obtained a leaked Scottish Executive briefing document, sent to finance minister Tom McCabe, which shows that ministers in Edinburgh have accepted that the cash will not be heading north.
The document, written by one of McCabe's officials, declares: "From experience with other policy areas we know that we would be unlikely to get this money back from Treasury and would have to make up the shortfall from Scottish Executive funding."
The document adds: "If in Scotland the council tax were replaced by a local income tax, council tax benefit would cease."
The precedent for the case being used by Executive officials is the row over the introduction of free personal care in Scotland in 2001. The introduction of the new right cancelled out another benefit, attendance allowance - worth £25m a year to Scotland. Despite lobbying from the Scottish Executive then, the money saved did not come north.
However, the Nationalists hit back last night, disputing the claims and accusing Labour of scare-mongering about the cost of their proposals. A spokesman said: "Labour is deliberately trying to scare people off about the cost of this as it tries to continue its defence of the unfair council tax. We have raised this issue with the DWP and with the Scottish Executive and we have never been told this is the case."
They said they would continue to pursue Whitehall over the matter. Nevertheless, the dispute will be damaging to their hopes of showing that the local income tax plan is financially viable.
This is a reality not just rhetoric...........
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 4:12pm Tue 20 Mar 07
Ally Cain wrote:
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
IS THIS WHAT OUR FOREFATHERS FOUGHT FOR ALLY?,I THINK NOT BUT YOU ILK EMBRACE IT WITH OPEN ARMS
Permanent protests in Parliament Square are to be banned by the Government in a bid to silence an antiwar activist loathed by many MPs.
The Home Office is set to announce today that the Organised Crime Bill will include a clause restricting demonstrations in front of the Commons.
Once the measures become law, 55-year-old Brian Haw will finally be evicted from the square after more than three years of continuous occupation.
The former carpenter set up camp in June 2001 and his banners, such as "You lie, kids die, Blair", are seen every time Tony Blair drives in or out of the Commons. But it is Mr Haw's constant anti-war chants on his megaphone, which can be heard in most MPs' offices, that have infuriated ministers and triggered the action.
Ministers will stress that the move will not endanger the ancient right to protest on the site but that it is time to introduce curbs on the practice to reduce noise nuisance.
Commons leader Peter Hain will signal the change in a debate on sessional orders, obscure parliamentary instruments that cover protection for MPs. Home Office minister Caroline Flint will underline the plans when she winds up the debate.
The Organised Crime Bill, which will be published in the Queen's Speech, will have clauses that ensure that protests are time-limited and covered by a specific permit. The clampdown will not ban pre-arranged protests such as the Countryside Alliance march which erupted in violence this summer. The moves will delight MPs, peers and parliamentary staff who have endured Mr Haw's 1,250-day protest.
Critics have complained that the protest, which attracts vigils for other causes, has created an eyesore at one of London's best-loved tourist sites.
Other MPs are sure to oppose the plans as a curb to the centuries-old right to free speech.
Mr Hain, a high-profile demonstrator in his youth, will stress that there is no question of the right to protest being significantly curtailed. But he will say that the time has come for a more sensible approach to regulating the demonstrations.
Ally Cain wrote:
You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn't fight the Nazi's just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country.
PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
IS THIS WHAT OUR FOREFATHERS FOUGHT FOR ALLY?,I THINK NOT BUT YOU ILK EMBRACE IT WITH OPEN ARMS
Permanent protests in Parliament Square are to be banned by the Government in a bid to silence an antiwar activist loathed by many MPs.
The Home Office is set to announce today that the Organised Crime Bill will include a clause restricting demonstrations in front of the Commons.
Once the measures become law, 55-year-old Brian Haw will finally be evicted from the square after more than three years of continuous occupation.
The former carpenter set up camp in June 2001 and his banners, such as "You lie, kids die, Blair", are seen every time Tony Blair drives in or out of the Commons. But it is Mr Haw's constant anti-war chants on his megaphone, which can be heard in most MPs' offices, that have infuriated ministers and triggered the action.
Ministers will stress that the move will not endanger the ancient right to protest on the site but that it is time to introduce curbs on the practice to reduce noise nuisance.
Commons leader Peter Hain will signal the change in a debate on sessional orders, obscure parliamentary instruments that cover protection for MPs. Home Office minister Caroline Flint will underline the plans when she winds up the debate.
The Organised Crime Bill, which will be published in the Queen's Speech, will have clauses that ensure that protests are time-limited and covered by a specific permit. The clampdown will not ban pre-arranged protests such as the Countryside Alliance march which erupted in violence this summer. The moves will delight MPs, peers and parliamentary staff who have endured Mr Haw's 1,250-day protest.
Critics have complained that the protest, which attracts vigils for other causes, has created an eyesore at one of London's best-loved tourist sites.
Other MPs are sure to oppose the plans as a curb to the centuries-old right to free speech.
Mr Hain, a high-profile demonstrator in his youth, will stress that there is no question of the right to protest being significantly curtailed. But he will say that the time has come for a more sensible approach to regulating the demonstrations.
Posted by: Des, Battlefield on 4:14pm Tue 20 Mar 07
PS Mr Brian Haw is still there,freedom of speech is alive & well unless you live in a socialist Scotland
PS Mr Brian Haw is still there,freedom of speech is alive & well unless you live in a socialist Scotland
Posted by: Mary Dole, 312-581 on 4:44pm Tue 20 Mar 07
"Mr Hain ... will say that the time has come for a more [italic]sensible approach to regulating the demonstrations[/italic] "
In other words the law will be implemented to suit the government.
Surely, the point of demonstrating against the governent is that it doesn't suit it?
This is just more repression from the Labour control-freaks. Someone should remind that lot that it is [bold]our[/bold] country and Parliament, not theirs (i.e. they are [bold]our[/bold] servants, not the other way around).
"Mr Hain ... will say that the time has come for a more
sensible approach to regulating the demonstrations "
In other words the law will be implemented to suit the government.
Surely, the point of demonstrating against the governent is that it doesn't suit it?
This is just more repression from the Labour control-freaks. Someone should remind that lot that it is
our country and Parliament, not theirs (i.e. they are
our servants, not the other way around).
Posted by: Des on 5:24pm Tue 20 Mar 07
Couldnt agree more Mary,getting more like a police state everyday......
Couldnt agree more Mary,getting more like a police state everyday......
Posted by: Ally Cain on 1:37pm Wed 21 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote: You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn\'t fight the Nazi\'s just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country. PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)[/quote] Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..[/quote] [bold]The mainstream parties are not all "saying the same thing" when it comes to dealing with immigration.
But none of them are proposing the extermination of Jews, Non-Whites, Aethists etc, as well as the complete destruction of british democracy as a solution to immigration problems. Is the BNPs rampant racial genocide and unapologetic Nazism the "alternative" British Parliment British people want?
And yes the SNP's customary anti-english bile is also as odious as the BNP's pro-White fascism.[/bold]
Des wrote:
Ally Cain wrote: You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn\'t fight the Nazi\'s just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country. PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..
The mainstream parties are not all "saying the same thing" when it comes to dealing with immigration.
But none of them are proposing the extermination of Jews, Non-Whites, Aethists etc, as well as the complete destruction of british democracy as a solution to immigration problems. Is the BNPs rampant racial genocide and unapologetic Nazism the "alternative" British Parliment British people want?
And yes the SNP's customary anti-english bile is also as odious as the BNP's pro-White fascism. Posted by: Ally Cain on 1:48pm Wed 21 Mar 07
[bold]My vote will go to the Scottish Unionist party or the Greens. The only two that have the minerals to oppose the destructive sectarian education system in the West Of Scotland which has traditonaly given us far more problems than immigration ever has[/bold] .
My vote will go to the Scottish Unionist party or the Greens. The only two that have the minerals to oppose the destructive sectarian education system in the West Of Scotland which has traditonaly given us far more problems than immigration ever has .
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 2:46pm Wed 21 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
[bold]My vote will go to the Scottish Unionist party or the Greens. The only two that have the minerals to oppose the destructive sectarian education system in the West Of Scotland which has traditonaly given us far more problems than immigration ever has[/bold] .[/quote] I agree with an end to all religious schools.
Including Church of Scotland, Catholic, Jewish and Muslim.
A disgracefull way to bring up children - filling their heads with nonsense and a vague feeling of superiority.
Ally Cain wrote:
My vote will go to the Scottish Unionist party or the Greens. The only two that have the minerals to oppose the destructive sectarian education system in the West Of Scotland which has traditonaly given us far more problems than immigration ever has .
I agree with an end to all religious schools.
Including Church of Scotland, Catholic, Jewish and Muslim.
A disgracefull way to bring up children - filling their heads with nonsense and a vague feeling of superiority.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 2:54pm Wed 21 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Des[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Ally Cain[/bold] wrote: You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn\'t fight the Nazi\'s just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country. PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)[/quote] Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..[/quote] [bold]The mainstream parties are not all "saying the same thing" when it comes to dealing with immigration.
But none of them are proposing the extermination of Jews, Non-Whites, Aethists etc, as well as the complete destruction of british democracy as a solution to immigration problems. Is the BNPs rampant racial genocide and unapologetic Nazism the "alternative" British Parliment British people want?
And yes the SNP's customary anti-english bile is also as odious as the BNP's pro-White fascism.[/bold] [/quote] Genocide? Extermination?
It is rubbish like this that is pushing people away from a real debate on immigration and politics.
Europe has not been so right wing since the 1920s - and why is that??
SNP have my first vote and the BNP have my second vote - thank you Ally you have finally convinced me.
To be perfectly honest Ally I couldn't care less about any more of your opinions - they are very limited.
Ally Cain wrote:
Des wrote:
Ally Cain wrote: You are entitled to vote whatever way you wish Thomas, but your BNP is going nowhere in Scotland and indeed in the UK as a whole. Our forefathers didn\'t fight the Nazi\'s just so that we could allow them in the back door of our country. PS-Mary Doyle. Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus and is often used on the net to duck PC hand-wringing liberal websites asterixing out the more common spelling of the word. :)
Just as a point of interest Ally,who would you suggest we vote for given that all the mainstream political parties are ineffectual & are all saying the same thing but doing very little apart from spilling out more rhetoric..Are not the SNP racist in some of their views in regard to our English cousins?..
The mainstream parties are not all "saying the same thing" when it comes to dealing with immigration.
But none of them are proposing the extermination of Jews, Non-Whites, Aethists etc, as well as the complete destruction of british democracy as a solution to immigration problems. Is the BNPs rampant racial genocide and unapologetic Nazism the "alternative" British Parliment British people want?
And yes the SNP's customary anti-english bile is also as odious as the BNP's pro-White fascism.
Genocide? Extermination?
It is rubbish like this that is pushing people away from a real debate on immigration and politics.
Europe has not been so right wing since the 1920s - and why is that??
SNP have my first vote and the BNP have my second vote - thank you Ally you have finally convinced me.
To be perfectly honest Ally I couldn't care less about any more of your opinions - they are very limited.
Posted by: Lee, Hamilton on 9:43pm Tue 27 Mar 07
Quote :"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
No 'WE' do n't!! . 'WE' want to look after our OWN people in our OWN country.We are not an adventure playground and private piggy bank for benfit tourists.
Quote :"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
No 'WE' do n't!! . 'WE' want to look after our OWN people in our OWN country.We are not an adventure playground and private piggy bank for benfit tourists.
Posted by: Thomas, Govanhill on 11:15pm Tue 27 Mar 07
[quote][bold]Lee[/bold] wrote:
Quote :"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
No 'WE' do n't!! . 'WE' want to look after our OWN people in our OWN country.We are not an adventure playground and private piggy bank for benfit tourists.
[/quote] I completely agree Lee - as do the vast makority of the people of Scotland. It is about time that the corrupt and cynical political classes woke up to the reality of the immigration situation.
Is it any wonder that lifetime socialists like me are intending to vote BNP - WHAT OTHE ALTERNATIVE IS THERE??????
Lee wrote:
Quote :"These people" choose to come here to escape a horrifically poor environment and to do the best for their families.
What is wrong with that?
Don't we all want to provide them with the best?
No 'WE' do n't!! . 'WE' want to look after our OWN people in our OWN country.We are not an adventure playground and private piggy bank for benfit tourists.
I completely agree Lee - as do the vast makority of the people of Scotland. It is about time that the corrupt and cynical political classes woke up to the reality of the immigration situation.
Is it any wonder that lifetime socialists like me are intending to vote BNP - WHAT OTHE ALTERNATIVE IS THERE??????
Posted by: Ngo Bidalla, London on 5:30am Thu 29 Mar 07
We should have open borders!!
Why are economic migrants treated so bedly?
Why are requests for asylum turned down? I think it is a disgrace!!!
Everyone who requests asylum in Britain should be given an immediate and unconditional right to remain here for as long as they want - indeed full citizenship with all benefits of health education and priority housing. These are people who have been through a lot of suffering and we have no right to question their motives.
I feel it would be appropriate that our communal taxes should be raised substantially with immediate effect to support and extend the asylum and support of all the peoples of the oppressed parts of the world.
We should make it known to the EU and the Western capatalist states that Britain intends to accept everyone who seeks asylum in our country no matter our national sacrafice and the cost.
We must start an emergency public education programme to prepare the working classes for the dramatic change in the nature of the British state - I believe these should be compulsory and include the unemployed.
People should be encouraged to give up parts of their own homes to welcome asylum victims.
We have a long way to go and so little has been achieved.
We should have open borders!!
Why are economic migrants treated so bedly?
Why are requests for asylum turned down? I think it is a disgrace!!!
Everyone who requests asylum in Britain should be given an immediate and unconditional right to remain here for as long as they want - indeed full citizenship with all benefits of health education and priority housing. These are people who have been through a lot of suffering and we have no right to question their motives.
I feel it would be appropriate that our communal taxes should be raised substantially with immediate effect to support and extend the asylum and support of all the peoples of the oppressed parts of the world.
We should make it known to the EU and the Western capatalist states that Britain intends to accept everyone who seeks asylum in our country no matter our national sacrafice and the cost.
We must start an emergency public education programme to prepare the working classes for the dramatic change in the nature of the British state - I believe these should be compulsory and include the unemployed.
People should be encouraged to give up parts of their own homes to welcome asylum victims.
We have a long way to go and so little has been achieved.
Posted by: paul m, govanhill on 9:31pm Sat 30 Jun 07
I have read the posts with regard to this article and I do accept that immigration into Glasgow is a long held tradition, I must add however that the Roma are different in so far as regardless of wherever have went all through history they have made no attempts what so ever to integrate and this alone ste them apart from previous immigrants. Whilst it is all very well for middle class liberals to sit discussing 'what do with the gypsies' and how to mix them with the 'poorly educated' working class glaswegians, however with all due respect you people do not live cheek to jowl with the gypsies and you have absolutely no idea of what their arrival (in droves) has and is doing to our community.
Yes many Immigrants have arrived over the decades with the hope of making a better life for themselves and their families, this is not the case with the gypsies nor has it ever been all through their history..they are and have always been insular and not intrested in intefrating with the host poulation in any way...that is why they are still with us in such numbers. Whilst other immigartion groups have endevoure to make life better for themselves and the host population by working hard and bringing much needed skills these people are poorly educated, don't speak the language,have no transferable skills or work experience it can be said that these people are of no use to the host population. It has to be said why are they here and what good are they to Glasgow...the answer is no good use at all and they are a drain on our benifit system.
I live here and these people truely are neighbours from hell and I wouldn't wish them on anyone. Govanhill in my opinion will explode in with racial unrest in the next year to 18 months unless something is done about the massive uncontrolled influx of gypsies into the area...and then we can all finally say goodbye to the myth that the Scots are so so tolerant....the Scots have never faced a problem like this on this scale before. After 20 years I'm moving out ASAP,I can put up with many,many things however these people are turning the area into a proper slum....soon it will be only them and those too poor to escape
I have read the posts with regard to this article and I do accept that immigration into Glasgow is a long held tradition, I must add however that the Roma are different in so far as regardless of wherever have went all through history they have made no attempts what so ever to integrate and this alone ste them apart from previous immigrants. Whilst it is all very well for middle class liberals to sit discussing 'what do with the gypsies' and how to mix them with the 'poorly educated' working class glaswegians, however with all due respect you people do not live cheek to jowl with the gypsies and you have absolutely no idea of what their arrival (in droves) has and is doing to our community.
Yes many Immigrants have arrived over the decades with the hope of making a better life for themselves and their families, this is not the case with the gypsies nor has it ever been all through their history..they are and have always been insular and not intrested in intefrating with the host poulation in any way...that is why they are still with us in such numbers. Whilst other immigartion groups have endevoure to make life better for themselves and the host population by working hard and bringing much needed skills these people are poorly educated, don't speak the language,have no transferable skills or work experience it can be said that these people are of no use to the host population. It has to be said why are they here and what good are they to Glasgow...the answer is no good use at all and they are a drain on our benifit system.
I live here and these people truely are neighbours from hell and I wouldn't wish them on anyone. Govanhill in my opinion will explode in with racial unrest in the next year to 18 months unless something is done about the massive uncontrolled influx of gypsies into the area...and then we can all finally say goodbye to the myth that the Scots are so so tolerant....the Scots have never faced a problem like this on this scale before. After 20 years I'm moving out ASAP,I can put up with many,many things however these people are turning the area into a proper slum....soon it will be only them and those too poor to escape
Posted by: paul m, govanhill on 4:18pm Sun 1 Jul 07
[quote][bold]Ngo Bidalla[/bold] wrote:
We should have open borders!! Why are economic migrants treated so bedly? Why are requests for asylum turned down? I think it is a disgrace!!! Everyone who requests asylum in Britain should be given an immediate and unconditional right to remain here for as long as they want - indeed full citizenship with all benefits of health education and priority housing. These are people who have been through a lot of suffering and we have no right to question their motives. I feel it would be appropriate that our communal taxes should be raised substantially with immediate effect to support and extend the asylum and support of all the peoples of the oppressed parts of the world. We should make it known to the EU and the Western capatalist states that Britain intends to accept everyone who seeks asylum in our country no matter our national sacrafice and the cost. We must start an emergency public education programme to prepare the working classes for the dramatic change in the nature of the British state - I believe these should be compulsory and include the unemployed. People should be encouraged to give up parts of their own homes to welcome asylum victims. We have a long way to go and so little has been achieved.[/quote] you are having a laugh....if you aren't then you should be deported immediately!
Ngo Bidalla wrote:
We should have open borders!! Why are economic migrants treated so bedly? Why are requests for asylum turned down? I think it is a disgrace!!! Everyone who requests asylum in Britain should be given an immediate and unconditional right to remain here for as long as they want - indeed full citizenship with all benefits of health education and priority housing. These are people who have been through a lot of suffering and we have no right to question their motives. I feel it would be appropriate that our communal taxes should be raised substantially with immediate effect to support and extend the asylum and support of all the peoples of the oppressed parts of the world. We should make it known to the EU and the Western capatalist states that Britain intends to accept everyone who seeks asylum in our country no matter our national sacrafice and the cost. We must start an emergency public education programme to prepare the working classes for the dramatic change in the nature of the British state - I believe these should be compulsory and include the unemployed. People should be encouraged to give up parts of their own homes to welcome asylum victims. We have a long way to go and so little has been achieved.
you are having a laugh....if you aren't then you should be deported immediately!
Posted by: paul m, govanhill on 1:05pm Mon 2 Jul 07
[quote][bold]Doug[/bold] wrote:
Just a comment, immigrants coming from the accession countries are NOT eligible for JSA - if you don't believe me, then check with your local office in Devon Place. They come here to do the jobs folk here won't do, in hospitality, cleaning and seasonal work. Having done it myself, I can say it isn't pleasant, but at least the minimum wage helps. And witness the fuss made when Gordon Brown rightly said all immigrants and newcomers to the UK should learn English. It only helps to be part of the society in which you live. You know how difficult it is when trying to converse with Greek waiters for a fortnight when you don't speak the language so imagine that 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not good for anyone.[/quote] Whilst it is correct that migrants from the EU are not entitled to JSA allowance... they are if they have children entitled to Income Support which then allows full access to all state benefits eg housing benefit,council tax benefit,child allowances,carers allowance,free dental care, free prescriptions,clothi
ng allowances etc etc...When the Govt etc say that migrants don't get JSA they fail to mention this...income support is infact the better benefit to be on. Check that out with the Benefits Agencey Doug
Doug wrote:
Just a comment, immigrants coming from the accession countries are NOT eligible for JSA - if you don't believe me, then check with your local office in Devon Place. They come here to do the jobs folk here won't do, in hospitality, cleaning and seasonal work. Having done it myself, I can say it isn't pleasant, but at least the minimum wage helps. And witness the fuss made when Gordon Brown rightly said all immigrants and newcomers to the UK should learn English. It only helps to be part of the society in which you live. You know how difficult it is when trying to converse with Greek waiters for a fortnight when you don't speak the language so imagine that 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not good for anyone.
Whilst it is correct that migrants from the EU are not entitled to JSA allowance... they are if they have children entitled to Income Support which then allows full access to all state benefits eg housing benefit,council tax benefit,child allowances,carers allowance,free dental care, free prescriptions,clothi
ng allowances etc etc...When the Govt etc say that migrants don't get JSA they fail to mention this...income support is infact the better benefit to be on. Check that out with the Benefits Agencey Doug
Posted by: paul m, govanhill on 1:13pm Mon 2 Jul 07
[quote][bold]Stef[/bold] wrote:
Doug and Rosie seem to be talking the most sense here. How many of us "Glaswegians" or our parents are originally from Scotland? Immigrants come to Scotland looking for a better life and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. Who wouldn't? How many Scottish people moved to Canada, Australia and New Zealand over the past decades to look for a better life and most of these people went with less than the new immigrants who arrive here. Yes, Glasgow has it's economic problems but don't blame these on the new immigrants. The local council receives money from the home office for taking in immigrants but doesn't seem to be spending it wisely enough. I would say though that there are probably social problems in Glasgow such as housing, schooling and transport that need to be addressed before we start taking in more vunerable people. [/quote] Local govt gets money for asylum seekers...local govt get nothing for taking on EU migrants...most of whom are 'grafters', this group are not hence the discussion
Stef wrote:
Doug and Rosie seem to be talking the most sense here. How many of us "Glaswegians" or our parents are originally from Scotland? Immigrants come to Scotland looking for a better life and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this. Who wouldn't? How many Scottish people moved to Canada, Australia and New Zealand over the past decades to look for a better life and most of these people went with less than the new immigrants who arrive here. Yes, Glasgow has it's economic problems but don't blame these on the new immigrants. The local council receives money from the home office for taking in immigrants but doesn't seem to be spending it wisely enough. I would say though that there are probably social problems in Glasgow such as housing, schooling and transport that need to be addressed before we start taking in more vunerable people.
Local govt gets money for asylum seekers...local govt get nothing for taking on EU migrants...most of whom are 'grafters', this group are not hence the discussion
Posted by: paul m, govanhill on 1:28pm Mon 2 Jul 07
[quote][bold]Varoomshka[/bold] wrote:
Thomas, you are supremely ignorant man. Not your fault but you need to learn true facts. East European people come to work. They do not get benefits or rent allowances. Their kids should go to schools paid for by taxes their parents pay. Big problem is maybe gangmasters and sleazy landlords exploit them. Who owns house they live in? How much they pay in rent? Are they getting minimum wage? Is gangmaster/mafia person taxing them? Is serious problem. If Thomas really want to help, find out who are landlords and gangmasters. [/quote] whilst it is true that migrants from the EU do not get Jobseekers allowance a fact that was widely publised by Central govt...a less well known fact is that if the migrant has children (which the gypsies do having come in families) then they do qualify for Income support which entitles the recepient full access to all state benefits eg housing benefit, council tax benefit,child allowance,carers allowances et, etc check with the Benefits Agencey. I know because I work there and all you taxpayers reading this are getting ripped off on a monumental scale, not just by the Gypsies although they are keeping us paticuarily busy just now. Imagine the nice schools and hospitals you good have if the taxpayer was not footing this bill.... still keeps me in a good job with loadsa overtime. I'm going to N.Zealand for my holidays this year where you going HaHA!
Varoomshka wrote:
Thomas, you are supremely ignorant man. Not your fault but you need to learn true facts. East European people come to work. They do not get benefits or rent allowances. Their kids should go to schools paid for by taxes their parents pay. Big problem is maybe gangmasters and sleazy landlords exploit them. Who owns house they live in? How much they pay in rent? Are they getting minimum wage? Is gangmaster/mafia person taxing them? Is serious problem. If Thomas really want to help, find out who are landlords and gangmasters.
whilst it is true that migrants from the EU do not get Jobseekers allowance a fact that was widely publised by Central govt...a less well known fact is that if the migrant has children (which the gypsies do having come in families) then they do qualify for Income support which entitles the recepient full access to all state benefits eg housing benefit, council tax benefit,child allowance,carers allowances et, etc check with the Benefits Agencey. I know because I work there and all you taxpayers reading this are getting ripped off on a monumental scale, not just by the Gypsies although they are keeping us paticuarily busy just now. Imagine the nice schools and hospitals you good have if the taxpayer was not footing this bill.... still keeps me in a good job with loadsa overtime. I'm going to N.Zealand for my holidays this year where you going HaHA!
Posted by: Hagen, Bree on 9:06pm Wed 2 Jan 08
ally said
""Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus"
"
This is untrue it has Always been," NAZI ".
Try to learn to admit your mistakes ! then you will not look to be such a Numptie !
ally said
""Natzi is the German, and original, abrv of Nationalsozialismus"
"
This is untrue it has Always been," NAZI ".
Try to learn to admit your mistakes ! then you will not look to be such a Numptie !
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