Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 10:58am Thu 13 Dec 07
The Evening Times is [b]still[/b] fly-posting on private property in Glasgow city centre:
[b]tinyurl.com/2x75xv[/b]
(copy-n-paste in to your browser url box.)
The Evening Times is still fly-posting on private property in Glasgow city centre:
tinyurl.com/2x75xv
(copy-n-paste in to your browser url box.)
Posted by: Bri, Glasgow on 11:07am Thu 13 Dec 07
Oh, it's £16million now? What happened to the the £100+ millions that were being banded about the other day? Someone finally come up with a "realistic" number, or bother to actually ask the Council for something, other than the names and addresses of people who have already admitted they done wrong and paid their fines....
Oh, it's £16million now? What happened to the the £100+ millions that were being banded about the other day? Someone finally come up with a "realistic" number, or bother to actually ask the Council for something, other than the names and addresses of people who have already admitted they done wrong and paid their fines....
Posted by: Big Al, Glasgow on 11:18am Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Bri[/bold] wrote:
Oh, it's £16million now? What happened to the the £100+ millions that were being banded about the other day? Someone finally come up with a "realistic" number, or bother to actually ask the Council for something, other than the names and addresses of people who have already admitted they done wrong and paid their fines....[/quote] I referred to £150million as the cost to UK cities as a whole for cleaning up chewing gum from a BBC article. £16million is Glasgow's figure for cleaning up mess that people drop. If you read the other articles, then you will know that £16million has already been quoted by the ET. Any more questions Bri?
£16million is by no means a realistic figure that we should accept. £16million is money wasted and literally thrown away.
Bri wrote:
Oh, it's £16million now? What happened to the the £100+ millions that were being banded about the other day? Someone finally come up with a "realistic" number, or bother to actually ask the Council for something, other than the names and addresses of people who have already admitted they done wrong and paid their fines....
I referred to £150million as the cost to UK cities as a whole for cleaning up chewing gum from a BBC article. £16million is Glasgow's figure for cleaning up mess that people drop. If you read the other articles, then you will know that £16million has already been quoted by the ET. Any more questions Bri?
£16million is by no means a realistic figure that we should accept. £16million is money wasted and literally thrown away.
Posted by: Big Al, Glasgow on 11:25am Thu 13 Dec 07
Also, if I'm doing my sums right, then £16million works out to be a £25 fine for every man, woman and child living in Glasgow. Everybody is being fined £25 each year, by the litterlouts who leave our city a mess. So my family is paying £100 a year - for what? Cos people can't be bothered using a bin!?!?!?
And to be honest, it is likely that we are indirectly paying more than this when you think that GCC only pick up rubbish on Council property. What about other places where people throw litter - businesses, shopping centres, private property.
If naming and shaming helps reduce the tax that litterlouts are forcing me to pay, then go for it.
Also, if I'm doing my sums right, then £16million works out to be a £25 fine for every man, woman and child living in Glasgow. Everybody is being fined £25 each year, by the litterlouts who leave our city a mess. So my family is paying £100 a year - for what? Cos people can't be bothered using a bin!?!?!?
And to be honest, it is likely that we are indirectly paying more than this when you think that GCC only pick up rubbish on Council property. What about other places where people throw litter - businesses, shopping centres, private property.
If naming and shaming helps reduce the tax that litterlouts are forcing me to pay, then go for it.
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 11:36am Thu 13 Dec 07
Ooh what a surprise... Big Al, whom yesterday I referred to as a "Glasgow City Council spokesman" is back on straight away trying to tear into members of the public attempting to voice their opinion! Not enough of course that he also gets a mention and a pat on the back from the ET editor in the article, under "Well done Evening Times!".
Come on Big Al, let's have some more of those wise gems of yours: like conveniently mixing up the cost of chewing gum removal for all UK cities, with the cost to Glasgow alone!!!
Ooh what a surprise... Big Al, whom yesterday I referred to as a "Glasgow City Council spokesman" is back on straight away trying to tear into members of the public attempting to voice their opinion! Not enough of course that he also gets a mention and a pat on the back from the ET editor in the article, under "Well done Evening Times!".
Come on Big Al, let's have some more of those wise gems of yours: like conveniently mixing up the cost of chewing gum removal for all UK cities, with the cost to Glasgow alone!!!
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 11:38am Thu 13 Dec 07
We all should be concerned about why the Evening Times has chosen to carry out this campaign using the language and phrases of outright violence: "we hit back", "we warned you", "you were well warned". If they are so confident that they are right, why are they addressing their audience like they're a mob of East End gangsters? Just who do they think they are? Is Donald Martin that insecure that he needs to threaten and harass people so that he can feel good about himself?
Nobody is disputing that litter is a problem. No one is disputing that people should be made to account for their actions.
What is under dispute is why the Evening Times has appointed themselves #1 Big Man and is embarking upon a shameless campaign of bullying, intimidation, and violence.
And as was discussed yesterday - the poll that states 74% support is bunk. It's not scientific, it's not independent, and it does not even prevent multiple voting. It's a PHP poll run through their own web site, and for all we know ET employees hit "refresh" until the numbers went into their favour. Can NUJ cards be revoked for being a disgrace to the profession?
We all should be concerned about why the Evening Times has chosen to carry out this campaign using the language and phrases of outright violence: "we hit back", "we warned you", "you were well warned". If they are so confident that they are right, why are they addressing their audience like they're a mob of East End gangsters? Just who do they think they are? Is Donald Martin that insecure that he needs to threaten and harass people so that he can feel good about himself?
Nobody is disputing that litter is a problem. No one is disputing that people should be made to account for their actions.
What is under dispute is why the Evening Times has appointed themselves #1 Big Man and is embarking upon a shameless campaign of bullying, intimidation, and violence.
And as was discussed yesterday - the poll that states 74% support is bunk. It's not scientific, it's not independent, and it does not even prevent multiple voting. It's a PHP poll run through their own web site, and for all we know ET employees hit "refresh" until the numbers went into their favour. Can NUJ cards be revoked for being a disgrace to the profession?
Posted by: VOICE OF REASON, glasgow on 11:43am Thu 13 Dec 07
I have been reluctent to post anything on this thread as am all for a crackdown on littering etc but there seems to be some draconian laws being dished out here. its one thing to be fined for the crime and maybe names on a paper isnt that bad...but addresses...thats a step too far ..big al lets talk hypotheticaly here...say you threw somthing in the bin..it misses and before you get the chance to pick it up..bang you have a fine and your name and [bold]bold[/bold] address is in a newspaper...would you be so quick to defend the evening times?....just a question..not a dig
I have been reluctent to post anything on this thread as am all for a crackdown on littering etc but there seems to be some draconian laws being dished out here. its one thing to be fined for the crime and maybe names on a paper isnt that bad...but addresses...thats a step too far ..big al lets talk hypotheticaly here...say you threw somthing in the bin..it misses and before you get the chance to pick it up..bang you have a fine and your name and address is in a newspaper...would you be so quick to defend the evening times?....just a question..not a dig
Posted by: david on 11:46am Thu 13 Dec 07
Evening Times has misjudged the readers on this issue.
Right technique used on wrong antisocial behaviours.
[bold]ET, listen, use your power for good. we all hate Neds and violence. Name and shame them.[/bold]
Its only because that anyone that drops litter isnt going to stab one of your journalists that your doing this. Bullys.
Evening Times has misjudged the readers on this issue.
Right technique used on wrong antisocial behaviours.
ET, listen, use your power for good. we all hate Neds and violence. Name and shame them.
Its only because that anyone that drops litter isnt going to stab one of your journalists that your doing this. Bullys.
Posted by: Meep, Shawlands on 11:46am Thu 13 Dec 07
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word [bold]news[/bold] here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word
news here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 11:47am Thu 13 Dec 07
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce).
This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing!
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce).
This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing!
Posted by: Bri, Glasgow on 11:53am Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Big Al[/bold] wrote:
Also, if I'm doing my sums right, then £16million works out to be a £25 fine for every man, woman and child living in Glasgow. Everybody is being fined £25 each year, by the litterlouts who leave our city a mess. So my family is paying £100 a year - for what? Cos people can't be bothered using a bin!?!?!? And to be honest, it is likely that we are indirectly paying more than this when you think that GCC only pick up rubbish on Council property. What about other places where people throw litter - businesses, shopping centres, private property. If naming and shaming helps reduce the tax that litterlouts are forcing me to pay, then go for it.[/quote] So that means that, on YOUR calculations, then my family are paying *counts up* £250 a year cause people can't be bothered using a bin? THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!! I'm right behind you now Big Al!!!!
Oh yeah, i have one more question...
Is it natural talent, or does it take years of practice to become a p***k like yourself? (Said with loads of sarcasm & tongue firmly in cheek...before you start moaning haha)
Big Al wrote:
Also, if I'm doing my sums right, then £16million works out to be a £25 fine for every man, woman and child living in Glasgow. Everybody is being fined £25 each year, by the litterlouts who leave our city a mess. So my family is paying £100 a year - for what? Cos people can't be bothered using a bin!?!?!? And to be honest, it is likely that we are indirectly paying more than this when you think that GCC only pick up rubbish on Council property. What about other places where people throw litter - businesses, shopping centres, private property. If naming and shaming helps reduce the tax that litterlouts are forcing me to pay, then go for it.
So that means that, on YOUR calculations, then my family are paying *counts up* £250 a year cause people can't be bothered using a bin? THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!! I'm right behind you now Big Al!!!!
Oh yeah, i have one more question...
Is it natural talent, or does it take years of practice to become a p***k like yourself? (Said with loads of sarcasm & tongue firmly in cheek...before you start moaning haha)
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 11:56am Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Meep[/bold] wrote:
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word [bold]news[/bold] here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.[/quote] Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century.
[bold]This campaign however isn't on the same level![/bold]
Meep wrote:
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word news here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century.
This campaign however isn't on the same level! Posted by: Bri, Glasgow on 11:57am Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Sydney Meriwether[/bold] wrote:
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce). This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing![/quote] As i also said yesterday Sydney, and i've not bothered to check if it's still there or been removed yet haha, was that it seems that "naming and shaming" is just a ploy to sell more papers because everyone knows that the ET's sales have been plummeting for some time now. I think they've only succeeded in LOWERING them further. Just a personal view though, which will probably be removed haha
Sydney Meriwether wrote:
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce). This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing!
As i also said yesterday Sydney, and i've not bothered to check if it's still there or been removed yet haha, was that it seems that "naming and shaming" is just a ploy to sell more papers because everyone knows that the ET's sales have been plummeting for some time now. I think they've only succeeded in LOWERING them further. Just a personal view though, which will probably be removed haha
Posted by: tangogal, glasgow on 12:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
The smug riposte fork the ET here also gives the impression that the majority of people who are against the printing of addresses are those who received the fines, when in fact they are simply readers who don't like these tactics. how many people who read the hard copy will look on the net and be aware of this?
Shabby tabloid journalism
The smug riposte fork the ET here also gives the impression that the majority of people who are against the printing of addresses are those who received the fines, when in fact they are simply readers who don't like these tactics. how many people who read the hard copy will look on the net and be aware of this?
Shabby tabloid journalism
Posted by: john, renfrew on 12:28pm Thu 13 Dec 07
MARIANNE TAYLOR (writter of this piece) and the editor of this petty little rag. You have the absolute check to insult people who critise your tattle tale little arguement. Then, you boast about some non-representive pole. Well, I tell you what, the truth will be in your distribution, which you numpties will destroy!!! No one wants this crap ok!!! Furthermore, why dont you and the editor perform a service to journalism by getting other jobs! I would suggest you could get green pvc jackets and join the litter nazi squad!!!!!
MARIANNE TAYLOR (writter of this piece) and the editor of this petty little rag. You have the absolute check to insult people who critise your tattle tale little arguement. Then, you boast about some non-representive pole. Well, I tell you what, the truth will be in your distribution, which you numpties will destroy!!! No one wants this crap ok!!! Furthermore, why dont you and the editor perform a service to journalism by getting other jobs! I would suggest you could get green pvc jackets and join the litter nazi squad!!!!!
Posted by: jimmykkk, Aberdeen on 12:33pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Sydney Meriwether[/bold] wrote:
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce). This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing![/quote] Well said Sydney. Now why don't we all refuse to buy this rag of a paper and close it down. We need a victory here. Power to the people!
Sydney Meriwether wrote:
Actually Heather, Mr Martin is very insecure: he's seen ET sales figures plummet, even with a 50% cut in cover price, together with point-of-sale freebies that amount to up to over 500% of that cover price (e.g. spaghetti bolognese sauce). This silly little campaign is the desperate act of a deperate publication, struggling for credibility... and losing!
Well said Sydney. Now why don't we all refuse to buy this rag of a paper and close it down. We need a victory here. Power to the people!
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 12:34pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Incidentally, as for the people-on-the-street photos on the editorial page in the print edition. A friend of mine was stopped on the street by an ET reporter and asked for her thoughts on something about parking, even though she doesn't drive. The photog still took her picture anyway and ran it in the print edition with a made-up quote. Nothing stands in the way of an ET reporter with a quota and a deadline, not even the truth.
Incidentally, as for the people-on-the-street photos on the editorial page in the print edition. A friend of mine was stopped on the street by an ET reporter and asked for her thoughts on something about parking, even though she doesn't drive. The photog still took her picture anyway and ran it in the print edition with a made-up quote. Nothing stands in the way of an ET reporter with a quota and a deadline, not even the truth.
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 12:52pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote]We have repeatedly warned the public we would name and shame - even before the litter wardens were in place.[/quote]
and the f*ck are you to warn the public?
We have repeatedly warned the public we would name and shame - even before the litter wardens were in place.
and the f*ck are you to warn the public?
Posted by: smarticus, Glasgow on 12:53pm Thu 13 Dec 07
It is about time we hit the real culprits in the litter debate. The manufacturers of chewing gum and cigarette should be taxed accordingly. They take the huge profits made from such items but the rate payers pick up the bill for cleaning it from the street. The fast food outlets are also to blame. The city centre is awash with excessive packaging from the many burger shops, pizza parlours and other fast food outlets. Even fish and chips now comes in an oversized cardboard box instead of a piece of greaseprof paper. These outlets should be made to provide their own staff to clear up the mess they create near their premises. Why don`t the city wardens fine the shop owners for creating the litter mountain in the first place. Its time for this paper to send their photographers around the city centre taking pictures of the pavements outside these fast food outlets and name and shame the suppliers for a change.
It is about time we hit the real culprits in the litter debate. The manufacturers of chewing gum and cigarette should be taxed accordingly. They take the huge profits made from such items but the rate payers pick up the bill for cleaning it from the street. The fast food outlets are also to blame. The city centre is awash with excessive packaging from the many burger shops, pizza parlours and other fast food outlets. Even fish and chips now comes in an oversized cardboard box instead of a piece of greaseprof paper. These outlets should be made to provide their own staff to clear up the mess they create near their premises. Why don`t the city wardens fine the shop owners for creating the litter mountain in the first place. Its time for this paper to send their photographers around the city centre taking pictures of the pavements outside these fast food outlets and name and shame the suppliers for a change.
Posted by: Johnny Punchclock, Glasgow on 12:55pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote]These outlets should be made to provide their own staff to clear up the mess they create near their premises.[/quote] I think they do.
These outlets should be made to provide their own staff to clear up the mess they create near their premises.
I think they do.
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 12:57pm Thu 13 Dec 07
and who the f*ck,
canny type, hungover
and who the f*ck,
canny type, hungover
Posted by: john, renfrew on 12:59pm Thu 13 Dec 07
.
Posted by: Johnny Punchclock, Glasgow on 1:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]yerauldda[/bold] wrote:
and who the f*ck,
canny type, hungover[/quote] The Evening Times must be worried if it's losing the support of Glasgow's problem drinker community!
yerauldda wrote:
and who the f*ck,
canny type, hungover
The Evening Times must be worried if it's losing the support of Glasgow's problem drinker community!
Posted by: Johnny Punchclock, Glasgow on 1:02pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
.[/quote] And the Renfrewshire minimalists!
john wrote:
.
And the Renfrewshire minimalists!
Posted by: john, renfrew on 1:02pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Okay lets look at this whole wonderful campagn. How many police officers would it have paid for? [bold]Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't police officers arrest litterers AND make the streets safers.[/bold]
Okay lets look at this whole wonderful campagn. How many police officers would it have paid for?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't police officers arrest litterers AND make the streets safers. Posted by: john, renfrew on 1:11pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Shame on you ET, you have insulted your readers and the intelligence of the people of Scotland!! You mention your bogus poll and call your readers louts! Most right thinking people are concerned about the Big Brother attitude of both you and the GCC. I think that both the editor AND writter of these articles should perform a service to journalism and get lost!! I would say to any shareholders in this group of newspaper, fire these jokers!!!
Shame on you ET, you have insulted your readers and the intelligence of the people of Scotland!! You mention your bogus poll and call your readers louts! Most right thinking people are concerned about the Big Brother attitude of both you and the GCC. I think that both the editor AND writter of these articles should perform a service to journalism and get lost!! I would say to any shareholders in this group of newspaper, fire these jokers!!!
Posted by: Gwennie, Glasgow on 1:12pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I totally agree that litter is a problem but there are bigger fish to fry. How many of these so called litter louts are wee old ladies or single women who have been swooped upon when instead of that they should be ridding the city centre of junkies/beggers etc (it is pretty scary someone coming up to you when you are on your own and interogating you). If Glasgow City Council look closer to home they will definitely rake in the pennies. You only have to look at John Street during tea break/lunchtime to see various GCC employees all smoking some of whom do not use a bin. If they are going to tackle the ordinary joe bloggs when their own employees are doing it then this is not right or fair.
I totally agree that litter is a problem but there are bigger fish to fry. How many of these so called litter louts are wee old ladies or single women who have been swooped upon when instead of that they should be ridding the city centre of junkies/beggers etc (it is pretty scary someone coming up to you when you are on your own and interogating you). If Glasgow City Council look closer to home they will definitely rake in the pennies. You only have to look at John Street during tea break/lunchtime to see various GCC employees all smoking some of whom do not use a bin. If they are going to tackle the ordinary joe bloggs when their own employees are doing it then this is not right or fair.
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 1:14pm Thu 13 Dec 07
By MARIANNE TAYLOR
TODAY the Evening Times hits back at those who have criticised us for naming and shaming Glasgow's litter louts.
Absolutely pathetic childish journalism.
Just think of it in business terms
For every fine and every name printed the ET will lose a sale.
Commercial suicide me thinks.
But well done anyway,ha,ha,ha.
By MARIANNE TAYLOR
TODAY the Evening Times hits back at those who have criticised us for naming and shaming Glasgow's litter louts.
Absolutely pathetic childish journalism.
Just think of it in business terms
For every fine and every name printed the ET will lose a sale.
Commercial suicide me thinks.
But well done anyway,ha,ha,ha.
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 1:23pm Thu 13 Dec 07
we should all dump our weeks rubbish on their office door
then burn it
fight the power!
we should all dump our weeks rubbish on their office door
then burn it
fight the power!
Posted by: thistlemad, Ayrshire on 1:27pm Thu 13 Dec 07
A few points here.
No litter equates to unemployment at the Cleansing Department.
Lack of bins is a problem.
Parents setting a bad example is another.
But remember the woman who was fined because her toddler grandchild dropped her crisps??
Do we REALLY want that sort of thing?
But the MAIN point, Labour are a disaster at everything they touch. The Tories are also a shower of known crooks. Immigration is causing REAL problems to the majority of Scots. Economic migrants (as they are called) are well known to be involved in organised crime. People are being murdered, raped, abused, tortured etc etc and what does the ET focus on??????????????? ............. thats right LITTER.
What a waste.
A few points here.
No litter equates to unemployment at the Cleansing Department.
Lack of bins is a problem.
Parents setting a bad example is another.
But remember the woman who was fined because her toddler grandchild dropped her crisps??
Do we REALLY want that sort of thing?
But the MAIN point, Labour are a disaster at everything they touch. The Tories are also a shower of known crooks. Immigration is causing REAL problems to the majority of Scots. Economic migrants (as they are called) are well known to be involved in organised crime. People are being murdered, raped, abused, tortured etc etc and what does the ET focus on??????????????? ............. thats right LITTER.
What a waste.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 1:27pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Here's a quote from the above article: [italic]By early next week, we'll have printed the names of more than 2000 offenders, all of whom have admitted their guilt by paying a £50 fine[/italic] . This is lies, in legal terms,people [bold]have not admitted their guilt[/bold] in paying a fixed penalty. Have you heard of slander ET, well you are committing it 3000 times!!! Most will pay the green jacket litter nazi wardens £50 to get them off their backs!!! They will not argue their innocence. In a lot of cases I would think that this will morally amount to extortion! Then they get their names printed in a paper!
Is there not better things that both you and the GCC could be doing. Have a look at the bigger picture. The streets arent safe to walk!!! Why dont you all take a good look at your priorities.
SACK THE EDITOR AND WRITER!!!!!!!
Here's a quote from the above article:
By early next week, we'll have printed the names of more than 2000 offenders, all of whom have admitted their guilt by paying a £50 fine . This is lies, in legal terms,people
have not admitted their guilt in paying a fixed penalty. Have you heard of slander ET, well you are committing it 3000 times!!! Most will pay the green jacket litter nazi wardens £50 to get them off their backs!!! They will not argue their innocence. In a lot of cases I would think that this will morally amount to extortion! Then they get their names printed in a paper!
Is there not better things that both you and the GCC could be doing. Have a look at the bigger picture. The streets arent safe to walk!!! Why dont you all take a good look at your priorities.
SACK THE EDITOR AND WRITER!!!!!!!
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 1:29pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]The Missing City[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Meep[/bold] wrote:
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word [bold]news[/bold] here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.[/quote] Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century.
[bold]This campaign however isn't on the same level![/bold] [/quote] This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.
The Missing City wrote:
Meep wrote:
I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word news here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century.
This campaign however isn't on the same level!
This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 1:34pm Thu 13 Dec 07
i wonder when they'll start fitting people up like the news of the world
i wonder when they'll start fitting people up like the news of the world
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 2:04pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Heather[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]The Missing City[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Meep[/bold] wrote: I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word [bold]news[/bold] here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.[/quote] Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century. [bold]This campaign however isn't on the same level![/bold] [/quote] This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.[/quote] [italic]As I said earlier in the week Heather Belle - its easy targets and they are not all from Glasgow either - from all over the world - but in Glasgow they can't seem to name the housebreakers or the paedo's etc for some strange reason - Pathetic it is 100%[/italic]
[bold]I wonder if its all part of the political merry go round, you know... keep the hard crime going and you have a right good old **** session at election time for votes as the candidtes for election square up to each other to win votes over who's going to wipe out serious crime - very sad state of affairs![/bold]
Heather wrote:
The Missing City wrote: Meep wrote: I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word news here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century. This campaign however isn't on the same level!
This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.
As I said earlier in the week Heather Belle - its easy targets and they are not all from Glasgow either - from all over the world - but in Glasgow they can't seem to name the housebreakers or the paedo's etc for some strange reason - Pathetic it is 100%
I wonder if its all part of the political merry go round, you know... keep the hard crime going and you have a right good old **** session at election time for votes as the candidtes for election square up to each other to win votes over who's going to wipe out serious crime - very sad state of affairs! Posted by: leesome, Glasgow on 2:05pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Evening Times, lets see you name and shame the councillors who allow vandalism to greet our tourists and our own rate payers eyes. You are all aware of GCC's policy of turning a blind eye to the graffiti at Charing Cross, now lets see the Times catch these vandals at Council chamber... The type of reporting seen above is more akin to the Digger, its cheap, nasty, and gives greater hazards to those who attempt to enforce a policy (do agree with), a policy that would have been better started by way of education & spot interviews to change attitudes not fixed penalty fines. Ask again: does this policy include those who are too young to be wage earners?
Evening Times, lets see you name and shame the councillors who allow vandalism to greet our tourists and our own rate payers eyes. You are all aware of GCC's policy of turning a blind eye to the graffiti at Charing Cross, now lets see the Times catch these vandals at Council chamber... The type of reporting seen above is more akin to the Digger, its cheap, nasty, and gives greater hazards to those who attempt to enforce a policy (do agree with), a policy that would have been better started by way of education & spot interviews to change attitudes not fixed penalty fines. Ask again: does this policy include those who are too young to be wage earners?
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 2:08pm Thu 13 Dec 07
When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about.
When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about.
Posted by: John, Glasgow on 2:09pm Thu 13 Dec 07
How ironic! On the day that the lead story is of yet another shooting in Glasgow the Evening Times decides to continue its fearless campaign to save us all from old ladies who drop bus tickets.
How ironic! On the day that the lead story is of yet another shooting in Glasgow the Evening Times decides to continue its fearless campaign to save us all from old ladies who drop bus tickets.
Posted by: Bri, Glasgow on 2:13pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Heather[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]The Missing City[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Meep[/bold] wrote: I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word [bold]news[/bold] here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.[/quote] Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century. [bold]This campaign however isn't on the same level![/bold] [/quote] This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.[/quote] The reason they don't ask real questions or get real statistics, is because then they'd have go OUT on the STREETS, do some REAL journalism, & run the risk of dropping litter...
Heather wrote:
The Missing City wrote: Meep wrote: I agree with Heather on this. The attitude of the editor Donald Martin seems very out of step with the readers of this newspaper.I emphasise the word news here. Although the Evening Timew has had a history of very good journalism in the 80's & 1990's and good scoial issue campaigns, this litter lout naming & shaming comes acorss has ver petty and more in line with something that New International would do with The Sun or the Daily Record. The Evening Times is supposed to be better than that. I feel Donal Martin's talents would be more suited the tastes of The Scottish Sun or Daily Record.
Yes, growing up I remember The Evening Times done a very good campaign for Old Clydeside workers who were suffering from Asbestos - a common material used in construction and engineering throughout the 20th century. This campaign however isn't on the same level!
This begs the question of why the ET chose not to approach "Clean Up Glasgow"as a truly constructive and positive campaign, and instead decided to become the corporate version of Glasgow's hard man image. Why not ask real questions, get real statistics, encourage a constructive dialogue and imagine some real solutions? It would have a bigger impact than threatening, harassing, and baiting the city. What an opportunity they missed by deciding that their sole contributions to the campaign would be mockery and violence.
The reason they don't ask real questions or get real statistics, is because then they'd have go OUT on the STREETS, do some REAL journalism, & run the risk of dropping litter...
Posted by: BhoyWunda, East Kilbride on 2:22pm Thu 13 Dec 07
What a load of rubbish
Posted by: john, renfrew on 2:30pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote:
When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about. [/quote] At least we dont have fallen skyscrappers littering our streets hen, brought down by MR Shrub!!!!
Scottish Rose wrote:
When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about.
At least we dont have fallen skyscrappers littering our streets hen, brought down by MR Shrub!!!!
Posted by: puskas, East Kilbride on 2:36pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Name and shame them and as I said double the fine...
Many warnings have been given to no effect over the years.
I obviously have no problem with any newspaper who are doing a great service in naming and shaming.
I do have a problem when they decide to take a backseat with in my opinion keeping quite with the sleaze, corruption from Wendy Bendy and associates. Their crimes are multiplied as they have been put into positions of trust by the electorate.
The Evening Times an others are ignoring all the evidence on Wendies crew for what reason?.
Lets get it front page in every newspaper Alexander and her motly crew..
Nu Labour failed the people of this country.
Name and shame them and as I said double the fine...
Many warnings have been given to no effect over the years.
I obviously have no problem with any newspaper who are doing a great service in naming and shaming.
I do have a problem when they decide to take a backseat with in my opinion keeping quite with the sleaze, corruption from Wendy Bendy and associates. Their crimes are multiplied as they have been put into positions of trust by the electorate.
The Evening Times an others are ignoring all the evidence on Wendies crew for what reason?.
Lets get it front page in every newspaper Alexander and her motly crew..
Nu Labour failed the people of this country.
Posted by: Stef, Glasgow on 2:44pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I think all these posts and the ones from yesterday make a complete mockery of the ET's claim that the vast majority of its readers support this childish and pathetic vendetta. I for one will not be buying the ET again and everyone I know was shocked when the names and addresses were printed. They are also of the same opinion. There is so much good the ET could do but instead concentrates on something the Sun would be proud of. As someone has already mentioned, paying the fixed penalty is not an admission of guilt. My friend received one in Shawlands for using a cashline machine where a mini-statement fell off while he was using it. The wardens refused to believe anything he said, he sent emails, letters explaining to the council what happened but was basically told pay it or else. Yes, litter is a problem but concentrate on more anti-social things like burglary, assault and drink driving and print the names of those people convicted of those offences. I will not be buying this paper anymore. Judging by the tone of the posts here, it is rational people who are disgusted with the ET's actions and some rather irrational people who are in favour of it.
I think all these posts and the ones from yesterday make a complete mockery of the ET's claim that the vast majority of its readers support this childish and pathetic vendetta. I for one will not be buying the ET again and everyone I know was shocked when the names and addresses were printed. They are also of the same opinion. There is so much good the ET could do but instead concentrates on something the Sun would be proud of. As someone has already mentioned, paying the fixed penalty is not an admission of guilt. My friend received one in Shawlands for using a cashline machine where a mini-statement fell off while he was using it. The wardens refused to believe anything he said, he sent emails, letters explaining to the council what happened but was basically told pay it or else. Yes, litter is a problem but concentrate on more anti-social things like burglary, assault and drink driving and print the names of those people convicted of those offences. I will not be buying this paper anymore. Judging by the tone of the posts here, it is rational people who are disgusted with the ET's actions and some rather irrational people who are in favour of it.
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 2:53pm Thu 13 Dec 07
City council leader Steven Purcell said: "I make no apologies for taking the decision to name and shame those people who have defaced our city's streets.
A wee bit of an over statement there Purcell.
Then again if persecuting people is what you are into, that's up to you.
At the end of the day it will lose labour votes. Which can only be a good thing.
City council leader Steven Purcell said: "I make no apologies for taking the decision to name and shame those people who have defaced our city's streets.
A wee bit of an over statement there Purcell.
Then again if persecuting people is what you are into, that's up to you.
At the end of the day it will lose labour votes. Which can only be a good thing.
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 2:56pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]benzema[/bold] wrote:
A fair assessmant would be that you got outclassed outplayed and outsung by Lyon from start to finish I am sure that getting the game cancelled against gretna helped you chase Lyon all over the pitch in the last 15 minutes and if you are honest with your self then you could not complain had Lyon scored 6or 7.... You achieved 7 pts after 3 games yet you fail to qualify from such an easy group as lyon and stuttgart and barca are no milan shaktar or benfica.. Your manager is a defeatist by playing 451 at home as lyon are not the team they were a few seasons back when the mighty green and white machine destroyed them at Paradise ... ps how much do you think aidedhino is worth if benzema is supposedly worth 15 million...? I am sure you also know that the uefa cup is your level and lets hope you draw shaktar or spartak moscow :-))) we are celtic we are the champions and we are the only scottish team in the cl last 16 and we have made another 15 million... [/quote] talking of litter.....
benzema wrote:
A fair assessmant would be that you got outclassed outplayed and outsung by Lyon from start to finish I am sure that getting the game cancelled against gretna helped you chase Lyon all over the pitch in the last 15 minutes and if you are honest with your self then you could not complain had Lyon scored 6or 7.... You achieved 7 pts after 3 games yet you fail to qualify from such an easy group as lyon and stuttgart and barca are no milan shaktar or benfica.. Your manager is a defeatist by playing 451 at home as lyon are not the team they were a few seasons back when the mighty green and white machine destroyed them at Paradise ... ps how much do you think aidedhino is worth if benzema is supposedly worth 15 million...? I am sure you also know that the uefa cup is your level and lets hope you draw shaktar or spartak moscow :-))) we are celtic we are the champions and we are the only scottish team in the cl last 16 and we have made another 15 million...
talking of litter.....
Posted by: Happychappy, glasgow on 2:56pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Stop giving licenses to the ever increasing number of fast food outlets and cut their opening times to before closing time at pubs.
It would save on mess around the city, reduce flair-ups with drunk individuals who congregate there and so help in a small way to reduce crime. If people knew they had to leave the pub an hour earlier to get food, they may leave the pub that bit earlier. Either way there would be no need to hang around town after leaving a pub at closing time.
Who knows, it might just mean that people won't eat as much fatty food.
If people knew that
The shops are unsightly and there are far more than are required surely.
We restrict taxi licenses, why not these places.
Stop giving licenses to the ever increasing number of fast food outlets and cut their opening times to before closing time at pubs.
It would save on mess around the city, reduce flair-ups with drunk individuals who congregate there and so help in a small way to reduce crime. If people knew they had to leave the pub an hour earlier to get food, they may leave the pub that bit earlier. Either way there would be no need to hang around town after leaving a pub at closing time.
Who knows, it might just mean that people won't eat as much fatty food.
If people knew that
The shops are unsightly and there are far more than are required surely.
We restrict taxi licenses, why not these places.
Posted by: enigma, glasgow on 2:57pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Ridiculous to print names and addresses when we're supposed to be conscious of potential identity theft. How much outrage does the [bold]ET[/bold] express when an institution loses private information?
Ridiculous to print names and addresses when we're supposed to be conscious of potential identity theft. How much outrage does the
ET express when an institution loses private information?
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 3:34pm Thu 13 Dec 07
If the ET prints the names and addresses of the
6332 victims, that could be a potential 37,992
sales of the ET down the Swanee per week.
I think this rag could do with a new editor and a new commercial manager if it wants to stay afloat. Oh and deffinetley new journalists.
If the ET prints the names and addresses of the
6332 victims, that could be a potential 37,992
sales of the ET down the Swanee per week.
I think this rag could do with a new editor and a new commercial manager if it wants to stay afloat. Oh and deffinetley new journalists.
Posted by: alexparade, Glasgow on 3:34pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I note they have taken their dodgy 'online poll' off the site - the comments on this story certainly don't suggest 75% in favour of this draconian harrassment. Presumably none of the '75%' could be bothered to comment, or perhaps to even think about why their knees jerked in support of this story..
The Evening Jackboot has effectively 'sacked' 2000 (potential) readers, by publicly humiliating them like this. Not to mention those like myself, who used to buy this paper every day, but after this week have decided to stop. Surely this will lead to a long-term drop in circulation, which will be far greater than any short-term sales boost from voyeurs wanting to see what their neighbours have been up to, this week?
The editor says: "The Evening Times is not alone in shaming law breakers -fare dodgers on Newcastle's Metro system are named and shamed by transport firm Nexus." Having been there last week, I can assure him that [bold]only offenders who have refused to pay their fines are publicly 'named and shamed' there, not the ones who paid their fines!![/bold] The only 'deterrent' effect naming and shaming will have is to deter people from admitting to the charge, as if they refuse to pay up for deliberately dropping litter the [italic]Evening Jackboot won't name them!!![/italic]
Come on politicians, grow a pair of balls. There is a growing groundswell of opinion against 'zero-tolerance' culture. Isn't it time some politicians or parties stood up against the nanny state?? There are votes to be made, maybe even enough to overthrow the corrupt religious fanatics at GCC, just like we overthrew the corrupt Labour Executive!!
I note they have taken their dodgy 'online poll' off the site - the comments on this story certainly don't suggest 75% in favour of this draconian harrassment. Presumably none of the '75%' could be bothered to comment, or perhaps to even think about why their knees jerked in support of this story..
The Evening Jackboot has effectively 'sacked' 2000 (potential) readers, by publicly humiliating them like this. Not to mention those like myself, who used to buy this paper every day, but after this week have decided to stop. Surely this will lead to a long-term drop in circulation, which will be far greater than any short-term sales boost from voyeurs wanting to see what their neighbours have been up to, this week?
The editor says: "The Evening Times is not alone in shaming law breakers -fare dodgers on Newcastle's Metro system are named and shamed by transport firm Nexus." Having been there last week, I can assure him that
only offenders who have refused to pay their fines are publicly 'named and shamed' there, not the ones who paid their fines!! The only 'deterrent' effect naming and shaming will have is to deter people from admitting to the charge, as if they refuse to pay up for deliberately dropping litter the
Evening Jackboot won't name them!!!
Come on politicians, grow a pair of balls. There is a growing groundswell of opinion against 'zero-tolerance' culture. Isn't it time some politicians or parties stood up against the nanny state?? There are votes to be made, maybe even enough to overthrow the corrupt religious fanatics at GCC, just like we overthrew the corrupt Labour Executive!!
Posted by: VOICE OF REASON, glasgow on 3:42pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I guess the ET is only doing what any brainless thug would do...when caught out and put to task for their mistake..they lash out or ome up with a fanciful story that sadly only there delude selves believe in..i just wonder if they actualy read any of the 60+ comments from yesterdays thread which a large percentage of slated them for this action...
I guess the ET is only doing what any brainless thug would do...when caught out and put to task for their mistake..they lash out or ome up with a fanciful story that sadly only there delude selves believe in..i just wonder if they actualy read any of the 60+ comments from yesterdays thread which a large percentage of slated them for this action...
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 3:45pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Quick, quick read the following from the Daily Record last month and have a laugh (or a cry):
"A Glasgow Litter warden with a dirty mouth called a teenager an "a***hole" after he dropped a cellophane cigarette wrapper in the street. But the crafty youngster used his mobile phone to record the four-letter rant."
Put this short url in your broswer for the full story:
tinyurl.com/3ddcme
Quick, quick read the following from the Daily Record last month and have a laugh (or a cry):
"A Glasgow Litter warden with a dirty mouth called a teenager an "a***hole" after he dropped a cellophane cigarette wrapper in the street. But the crafty youngster used his mobile phone to record the four-letter rant."
Put this short url in your broswer for the full story:
tinyurl.com/3ddcme
Posted by: Paul, south west on 3:47pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I agree with the Evening Times. They are trying to help clean up Glasgow. One person spitting out their chewing gum or flicking their cigarette butt at the pavement doesn't warrant a mention in a newspaper. BUT it isn't one person doing this, there are thousands!! THAT'S WHY IT IS A PROBLEM!! It will never be stopped (unless we take the same stance as, say, Singapore) but it must be reduced and it is not just about the £16 million or however much, it is about not trailing chewing gum through your house and having to look at the rubbish lying on the streets.
I agree with the Evening Times. They are trying to help clean up Glasgow. One person spitting out their chewing gum or flicking their cigarette butt at the pavement doesn't warrant a mention in a newspaper. BUT it isn't one person doing this, there are thousands!! THAT'S WHY IT IS A PROBLEM!! It will never be stopped (unless we take the same stance as, say, Singapore) but it must be reduced and it is not just about the £16 million or however much, it is about not trailing chewing gum through your house and having to look at the rubbish lying on the streets.
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 3:50pm Thu 13 Dec 07
...oops, wrong one:
tinyurl.com/2lfff9
...oops, wrong one:
tinyurl.com/2lfff9
Posted by: john, renfrew on 3:57pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Lets examine your demographic Evening Times. Most of the people who can use a computer or above a certain level of intellegence will not buy little rag anyway.
I was out for a walk today and I got talking to a bloke standing outside a pub in my toon. I asked him what he thought of the Evening Times publishing folks details. I will loosely quote him 'I think its great, wee Mrs X is there, so is Mr Y oh and he's named twice...' he continued in this gleefull tone. As we parted, he casually threw his cigarette end onto the street.
I guess, he will remain an ET reader, I will never be one again!!!!!
Lets examine your demographic Evening Times. Most of the people who can use a computer or above a certain level of intellegence will not buy little rag anyway.
I was out for a walk today and I got talking to a bloke standing outside a pub in my toon. I asked him what he thought of the Evening Times publishing folks details. I will loosely quote him 'I think its great, wee Mrs X is there, so is Mr Y oh and he's named twice...' he continued in this gleefull tone. As we parted, he casually threw his cigarette end onto the street.
I guess, he will remain an ET reader, I will never be one again!!!!!
Posted by: jonny bond, glasgow on 4:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Anybody ever seen a copy of this paper littering the streets of glasgow I have on many occasions. Lets name and shame the printers after all if it were a net only paper there would be no litter. So lets all help the evening times by avoiding buying litter.
Anybody ever seen a copy of this paper littering the streets of glasgow I have on many occasions. Lets name and shame the printers after all if it were a net only paper there would be no litter. So lets all help the evening times by avoiding buying litter.
Posted by: alexparade, Glasgow on 4:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Paul[/bold] wrote:
I agree with the Evening Times. They are trying to help clean up Glasgow. One person spitting out their chewing gum or flicking their cigarette butt at the pavement doesn't warrant a mention in a newspaper. BUT it isn't one person doing this, there are thousands!! THAT'S WHY IT IS A PROBLEM!! It will never be stopped (unless we take the same stance as, say, Singapore) but it must be reduced and it is not just about the £16 million or however much, it is about not trailing chewing gum through your house and having to look at the rubbish lying on the streets.[/quote] Watch where you are putting your feet then! I see what is happening here, you and your chattering-class contemporaries actually don't have anything else to worry about, as your southside or west-end ivory tower hideaways are a world apart from the real Glasgow the rest of us live in, with it's rampant violence and sex-crimes.. last night about 11pm I was waiting at the bus stop (not an experience any ET 'journalists' are familiar with, I realise) when a ned in his 20s was drinking openly from a Buckfast bottle, threatening passers by and racially abusing tourists sitting outside a nearby bar. I wondered aloud where the various wardens were at that time of night..
Paul wrote:
I agree with the Evening Times. They are trying to help clean up Glasgow. One person spitting out their chewing gum or flicking their cigarette butt at the pavement doesn't warrant a mention in a newspaper. BUT it isn't one person doing this, there are thousands!! THAT'S WHY IT IS A PROBLEM!! It will never be stopped (unless we take the same stance as, say, Singapore) but it must be reduced and it is not just about the £16 million or however much, it is about not trailing chewing gum through your house and having to look at the rubbish lying on the streets.
Watch where you are putting your feet then! I see what is happening here, you and your chattering-class contemporaries actually don't have anything else to worry about, as your southside or west-end ivory tower hideaways are a world apart from the real Glasgow the rest of us live in, with it's rampant violence and sex-crimes.. last night about 11pm I was waiting at the bus stop (not an experience any ET 'journalists' are familiar with, I realise) when a ned in his 20s was drinking openly from a Buckfast bottle, threatening passers by and racially abusing tourists sitting outside a nearby bar. I wondered aloud where the various wardens were at that time of night..
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 4:05pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Did you see this late comment on the page with yesterday's story? Not even GCSS themselves support this witchhunt.
Posted by: tonzod, glasgow on 2:41am today
as a serving enforcement officer with GCSS, the one's who are issuing the majority of the tickets, as opposed to the litter wardens whom you credited in your article, I feel it is inappropriate to name the littering offenders. They have already been penalised for thier offence, namely a £50 fixed penalty which they have paid. Would it not have been more appropriate to name the offender's who have not paid, or name the members of the public who verbally and physically abuse us on a daily basis. [bold]Myself and my fellow officers feel that by printing the list of names increases the risk to ourselves out on the street, people will be less likley to submit thier details if they feel there is a risk of thier names and addresses appearing in print and more likely to be aggressive towards us.[/bold] I wish to make it clear that we are not litter wardens and our duties go a lot further than just targeting "litter louts", we have been deployed to combat gang violence, street drinking, public reassurance and much more. Although we are behind the evening times's campain we feel it would be better for all concerned if we were asked before any articles were printed about us. We being the enforcement officers out on the street issuing tickets, not management.
Did you see this late comment on the page with yesterday's story? Not even GCSS themselves support this witchhunt.
Posted by: tonzod, glasgow on 2:41am today
as a serving enforcement officer with GCSS, the one's who are issuing the majority of the tickets, as opposed to the litter wardens whom you credited in your article, I feel it is inappropriate to name the littering offenders. They have already been penalised for thier offence, namely a £50 fixed penalty which they have paid. Would it not have been more appropriate to name the offender's who have not paid, or name the members of the public who verbally and physically abuse us on a daily basis.
Myself and my fellow officers feel that by printing the list of names increases the risk to ourselves out on the street, people will be less likley to submit thier details if they feel there is a risk of thier names and addresses appearing in print and more likely to be aggressive towards us. I wish to make it clear that we are not litter wardens and our duties go a lot further than just targeting "litter louts", we have been deployed to combat gang violence, street drinking, public reassurance and much more. Although we are behind the evening times's campain we feel it would be better for all concerned if we were asked before any articles were printed about us. We being the enforcement officers out on the street issuing tickets, not management.
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 4:05pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about. [/quote] At least we dont have fallen skyscrappers littering our streets hen, brought down by MR Shrub!!!![/quote] Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...now do you. As for the "Hen" name you called me, thanks!! Haven't been called that in years!!
john wrote:
Scottish Rose wrote: When I was home last year Glasgow WAS a mess!! I dont ever remember seeing that much trash laying around. It's about time it's being cleaned up. If that means naming people that throw it on the ground, oh well. And for those of you that dont litter, you've got nothing to worry about.
At least we dont have fallen skyscrappers littering our streets hen, brought down by MR Shrub!!!!
Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...now do you. As for the "Hen" name you called me, thanks!! Haven't been called that in years!!
Posted by: john, renfrew on 4:10pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Scottish Rose, you should have told you president: [italic]Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...[/italic]
Scottish Rose, you should have told you president:
Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about... Posted by: john, renfrew on 4:14pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]jonny bond[/bold] wrote:
Anybody ever seen a copy of this paper littering the streets of glasgow I have on many occasions. Lets name and shame the printers after all if it were a net only paper there would be no litter. So lets all help the evening times by avoiding buying litter.[/quote] hahahaha
jonny bond wrote:
Anybody ever seen a copy of this paper littering the streets of glasgow I have on many occasions. Lets name and shame the printers after all if it were a net only paper there would be no litter. So lets all help the evening times by avoiding buying litter.
hahahaha
Posted by: Murraymint, Kilbarchan on 4:14pm Thu 13 Dec 07
A few years ago New York had similar problems to Glasgow with regard to crime,litter,lack of civic pride etc. The city authorities decided that the way to tackle these deep-seated problems was to instigate a policy of zero-tolerance, concentrating on low level crime and anti-social behaviour, in the belief that if this action was successful it would help cut levels of all crime.
It was so successful that the appearance of the city has improved out of all recognition, and more importantly all levels of crime have been reduced.
If this system has been successful in New York it is certainly worth a try in Scotland, not just Glasgow. We have now reached the stage in this country where there is almost a complete lack of any sense of civic responsibility amongst a large section of the population, who seem to think that they can just do as they like with no one in authority questioning their actions.If naming and shaming some of these people is the only way to achieve a positive outcome,then so be it. After all, it's not as if they were unaware of the law.
There is no point in blaming the Evening Times for peoples' antisocial behaviour, and as for fatuous comments about identity theft, just look up any telephone directory where you can see literally thousands of names and addresses.
Finally,I don't think that the frequently foul-mouthed contributors to these debates can in any way regard themselves as any more representative of the ET's readership than anyone else.
A few years ago New York had similar problems to Glasgow with regard to crime,litter,lack of civic pride etc. The city authorities decided that the way to tackle these deep-seated problems was to instigate a policy of zero-tolerance, concentrating on low level crime and anti-social behaviour, in the belief that if this action was successful it would help cut levels of all crime.
It was so successful that the appearance of the city has improved out of all recognition, and more importantly all levels of crime have been reduced.
If this system has been successful in New York it is certainly worth a try in Scotland, not just Glasgow. We have now reached the stage in this country where there is almost a complete lack of any sense of civic responsibility amongst a large section of the population, who seem to think that they can just do as they like with no one in authority questioning their actions.If naming and shaming some of these people is the only way to achieve a positive outcome,then so be it. After all, it's not as if they were unaware of the law.
There is no point in blaming the Evening Times for peoples' antisocial behaviour, and as for fatuous comments about identity theft, just look up any telephone directory where you can see literally thousands of names and addresses.
Finally,I don't think that the frequently foul-mouthed contributors to these debates can in any way regard themselves as any more representative of the ET's readership than anyone else.
Posted by: Big Al, Glasgow on 4:18pm Thu 13 Dec 07
How about we start our own poll within the comments to see how different it is to the anonymous one. Just post a comment with yes or no, then someone can add it up at the end of the day (unless ET deletes the posts.)
Same question as before: [bold]Should litter louts be named and shamed?[/bold]
How about we start our own poll within the comments to see how different it is to the anonymous one. Just post a comment with yes or no, then someone can add it up at the end of the day (unless ET deletes the posts.)
Same question as before:
Should litter louts be named and shamed? Posted by: Big Al, Glasgow on 4:19pm Thu 13 Dec 07
yes
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 4:20pm Thu 13 Dec 07
NNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOO
NNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOO
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 4:22pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote]"We have now reached the stage in this country where there is almost a complete lack of any sense of civic responsibility amongst a large section of the population, who seem to think that they can just do as they like with no one in authority questioning their actions."[/quote]
That describes the Evening Times perfectly.
"We have now reached the stage in this country where there is almost a complete lack of any sense of civic responsibility amongst a large section of the population, who seem to think that they can just do as they like with no one in authority questioning their actions."
That describes the Evening Times perfectly.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 4:22pm Thu 13 Dec 07
No
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 4:24pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Five hours since your last rabble Big Al (aka GCC spokesman)... where you been... a tea break? ;)
Five hours since your last rabble Big Al (aka GCC spokesman)... where you been... a tea break? ;)
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 4:31pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
Scottish Rose, you should have told you president: [italic]Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...[/italic] [/quote] Love you too!!!! John.
john wrote:
Scottish Rose, you should have told you president: Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...
Love you too!!!! John.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 4:32pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[bold]Here's what The Evening Times and Murraymint stands for:[/bold]
[bold]Toddler fined for dropping a crisp:[/bold]
http://news.bbc.co.u
k/1/hi/england/susse
x/6665641.stm
[bold]Litter Wardens spying on drivers:[/bold]
http://www.doncaster
freepress.co.uk/free
-press-news/Litter-w
ardens-lie-in-wait.3
436138.jp
[bold]Litter wardens harass 13 year old girls:[/bold]
http://www.mancheste
reveningnews.co.uk/n
ews/s/228/228668_lit
ter_wardens_right_to
_hand_fines_to_kids.
html
[bold]Litter warden assaults teenager:[/bold]
http://www.dailyreco
rd.co.uk/news/scotti
sh-news/2007/11/22/l
itter-row-rumpus-in-
glasgow-86908-201433
97/
Here's what The Evening Times and Murraymint stands for:
Toddler fined for dropping a crisp:
http://news.bbc.co.u
k/1/hi/england/susse
x/6665641.stm
Litter Wardens spying on drivers:
http://www.doncaster
freepress.co.uk/free
-press-news/Litter-w
ardens-lie-in-wait.3
436138.jp
Litter wardens harass 13 year old girls:
http://www.mancheste
reveningnews.co.uk/n
ews/s/228/228668_lit
ter_wardens_right_to
_hand_fines_to_kids.
html
Litter warden assaults teenager:
http://www.dailyreco
rd.co.uk/news/scotti
sh-news/2007/11/22/l
itter-row-rumpus-in-
glasgow-86908-201433
97/
Posted by: john, renfrew on 4:36pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: Scottish Rose, you should have told you president: [italic]Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...[/italic] [/quote] Love you too!!!! John.[/quote] Apparantly You have enough intelligence to get out of your own dump. Unfortunatley you don't have the prerequisite half a brain to recognise humbug when you see it!!!!!
Scottish Rose wrote:
john wrote: Scottish Rose, you should have told you president: Like I said..If you dont drop it, you've got nothing to worry about...
Love you too!!!! John.
Apparantly You have enough intelligence to get out of your own dump. Unfortunatley you don't have the prerequisite half a brain to recognise humbug when you see it!!!!!
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 5:00pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
Posted by: SwimFishSwim, Glasgow on 5:08pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I've just read these comments with interest as well as following the Evening Times' naming exercise for a couple of reasons. Firstly i was issued a fixed penalty notice on Argyle Street back in June of this year. I did not agree with this decision and have so far refused to pay the fine. Littering under the Enviromental Protection Act 1991 (under which you are fined) makes littering a criminal act which in Scotland has to be addressed by a sherriff. However, the definition of littering according to the act is if you drop of discard an item and walk away. If, like in my case i dropped an item and then picked it up and disposed of it in a bin before being issued the fine, then you haven't littered. This is part of the reason why i have so far not payed the fine and have informed the council that i am willing to take this matter to court. So far i have had no summons and had no contact from the council since July. My last correspondense to them was a letter i sent in September informing them of my intentions for which i never received a reply.
Secondly, and more importantly, i noticed a problem with how the fine was issued. Under the statutory Order 426 , passed by the Scottish Parliament in 2004, which covers how the fine should read and be issued it states the the Officer or the person with authority should put their name on the fixed-penalty notice when issuing the fine. However, in mine the wardens had only put down their id numbers and not their names. After checking with various criminal defence law firms they all came to the conclusion that the fine had not correctly been issued and were confident that the fine could be overturned on this basis. Bare in mind that the offence is a criminal one and the authorities have to follow the letter of the law.
From further research into this matter, and from examining 12 other persons fines, everyone of them did not properly identify the wardens by name, a legal requirement. Therefore for those who have paid, please check your fine, i believe that from March until 7th October (when the Sunday Mail published a story on this matter) every fine issued has been done so illegally. If you haven't paid it then by all means contact a lawyer. If you have paid it then the council may well have illegally collected money.
I look forward to the Evening Times looking into this matter and perhaps asking questions regarding why the litter wardens were not properly identifying themsleves when there was a legal requirement to so and maybe asking how far up the council this goes. I also hope that the paper is confident that all the names they are printing are of people who have been correctly issued with these fixed penalty notices and have paid because i will not hesitate to take legal action against both the Times and Glasgow City Council if i see my name appearing for a matter that is by far from complete.
I've just read these comments with interest as well as following the Evening Times' naming exercise for a couple of reasons. Firstly i was issued a fixed penalty notice on Argyle Street back in June of this year. I did not agree with this decision and have so far refused to pay the fine. Littering under the Enviromental Protection Act 1991 (under which you are fined) makes littering a criminal act which in Scotland has to be addressed by a sherriff. However, the definition of littering according to the act is if you drop of discard an item and walk away. If, like in my case i dropped an item and then picked it up and disposed of it in a bin before being issued the fine, then you haven't littered. This is part of the reason why i have so far not payed the fine and have informed the council that i am willing to take this matter to court. So far i have had no summons and had no contact from the council since July. My last correspondense to them was a letter i sent in September informing them of my intentions for which i never received a reply.
Secondly, and more importantly, i noticed a problem with how the fine was issued. Under the statutory Order 426 , passed by the Scottish Parliament in 2004, which covers how the fine should read and be issued it states the the Officer or the person with authority should put their name on the fixed-penalty notice when issuing the fine. However, in mine the wardens had only put down their id numbers and not their names. After checking with various criminal defence law firms they all came to the conclusion that the fine had not correctly been issued and were confident that the fine could be overturned on this basis. Bare in mind that the offence is a criminal one and the authorities have to follow the letter of the law.
From further research into this matter, and from examining 12 other persons fines, everyone of them did not properly identify the wardens by name, a legal requirement. Therefore for those who have paid, please check your fine, i believe that from March until 7th October (when the Sunday Mail published a story on this matter) every fine issued has been done so illegally. If you haven't paid it then by all means contact a lawyer. If you have paid it then the council may well have illegally collected money.
I look forward to the Evening Times looking into this matter and perhaps asking questions regarding why the litter wardens were not properly identifying themsleves when there was a legal requirement to so and maybe asking how far up the council this goes. I also hope that the paper is confident that all the names they are printing are of people who have been correctly issued with these fixed penalty notices and have paid because i will not hesitate to take legal action against both the Times and Glasgow City Council if i see my name appearing for a matter that is by far from complete.
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 5:09pm Thu 13 Dec 07
John ,
this poxy rag has ersed up your links cant get any to work.
Does the ET think by disrupting links about the scourge of these thug wardens we will not find the truth?
Pathetic kids stuff.
John ,
this poxy rag has ersed up your links cant get any to work.
Does the ET think by disrupting links about the scourge of these thug wardens we will not find the truth?
Pathetic kids stuff.
Posted by: Meep, Shawlands on 5:10pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I am going to make a prediction: If Donald Martin doesnt change his strategy for the Evening Times then Newquest will either move Martin or sack him. This litter bug saga is just one of many articles which have totally alienated the readership of the Evening Times over the last couple of years. The readership of the Evening Times is more intellligent than Donald Martin relises. We are not Sun or Daily Record readers. [bold]We actually want to know[/bold] [bold]whats happening in Glasgow[/bold] . Why Martin doesnt se this i dont know.
I am going to make a prediction: If Donald Martin doesnt change his strategy for the Evening Times then Newquest will either move Martin or sack him. This litter bug saga is just one of many articles which have totally alienated the readership of the Evening Times over the last couple of years. The readership of the Evening Times is more intellligent than Donald Martin relises. We are not Sun or Daily Record readers.
We actually want to know whats happening in Glasgow . Why Martin doesnt se this i dont know.
Posted by: jimmykkk, Aberdeen on 5:14pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Big Al[/bold] wrote:
yes[/quote] Boring or what. Get a life
Big Al wrote:
yes
Boring or what. Get a life
Posted by: ex labour voter, glasgow on 5:16pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Well done SwimFishSwim you deserve a round of applause.
Typical of the labour infested coonsil to get it wrong by trying to hide the identity of Purcell,s puppets.
Well done SwimFishSwim you deserve a round of applause.
Typical of the labour infested coonsil to get it wrong by trying to hide the identity of Purcell,s puppets.
Posted by: Murraymint, Kilbarchan on 5:20pm Thu 13 Dec 07
The reply from John of Renfrew to my previous post is exactly what I expected.
Nothing positive to say, just a lot of irrelevant and exagerrated nonsense, which offered nothing constructive to the debate as usual.
And,why must he and others of his ilk resort to personal abuse. Is it only a juvenile attempt to provoke a reaction? Absolutely childish!
The reply from John of Renfrew to my previous post is exactly what I expected.
Nothing positive to say, just a lot of irrelevant and exagerrated nonsense, which offered nothing constructive to the debate as usual.
And,why must he and others of his ilk resort to personal abuse. Is it only a juvenile attempt to provoke a reaction? Absolutely childish!
Posted by: SwimFishSwim, Glasgow on 5:23pm Thu 13 Dec 07
The council and now the Times are on shakey ground if a court decides that by not putting their names on the Fixed-Penalty Notices they have not issued them correctly. For the 6 month period i belive about 4000 fines were issued. At present the Council has not taken any legal action against anyone (myself included) for non-payment as it would mean going in front of a PF as it is a criminal matter. I would love to see Stephen Purcell explaining away this one and the Times wondering what to do about naming 2000 people wrongly fined.
I wonder why?
The council and now the Times are on shakey ground if a court decides that by not putting their names on the Fixed-Penalty Notices they have not issued them correctly. For the 6 month period i belive about 4000 fines were issued. At present the Council has not taken any legal action against anyone (myself included) for non-payment as it would mean going in front of a PF as it is a criminal matter. I would love to see Stephen Purcell explaining away this one and the Times wondering what to do about naming 2000 people wrongly fined.
I wonder why?
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 5:33pm Thu 13 Dec 07
A little birdie tells me Renfield Street is not amused.
Tune in tomorrow to watch the ET dig its grave even deeper.
A little birdie tells me Renfield Street is not amused.
Tune in tomorrow to watch the ET dig its grave even deeper.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 5:33pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote:
Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts!
Scottish Rose wrote:
Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 5:34pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Murraymint[/bold] wrote:
The reply from John of Renfrew to my previous post is exactly what I expected. Nothing positive to say, just a lot of irrelevant and exagerrated nonsense, which offered nothing constructive to the debate as usual. And,why must he and others of his ilk resort to personal abuse. Is it only a juvenile attempt to provoke a reaction? Absolutely childish![/quote] Totally AGREE!!!!
Murraymint wrote:
The reply from John of Renfrew to my previous post is exactly what I expected. Nothing positive to say, just a lot of irrelevant and exagerrated nonsense, which offered nothing constructive to the debate as usual. And,why must he and others of his ilk resort to personal abuse. Is it only a juvenile attempt to provoke a reaction? Absolutely childish!
Totally AGREE!!!!
Posted by: john, renfrew on 5:40pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]ex labour voter[/bold] wrote:
John , this poxy rag has ersed up your links cant get any to work. Does the ET think by disrupting links about the scourge of these thug wardens we will not find the truth? Pathetic kids stuff.[/quote] I noticed that earlier ex-labour voter. I put the main points a la tabloid style, just like The Evening Times does. If anyone wants to see the full stories, they can copy and paste line by line. I know, its a pain in the rrrs
ex labour voter wrote:
John , this poxy rag has ersed up your links cant get any to work. Does the ET think by disrupting links about the scourge of these thug wardens we will not find the truth? Pathetic kids stuff.
I noticed that earlier ex-labour voter. I put the main points a la tabloid style, just like The Evening Times does. If anyone wants to see the full stories, they can copy and paste line by line. I know, its a pain in the rrrs
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 5:40pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts![/quote] Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
john wrote:
Scottish Rose wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 6:00pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts![/quote] Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.[/quote] Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much!
Scottish Rose wrote:
john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much!
Posted by: Whoop-de_doo, Arizona on 6:04pm Thu 13 Dec 07
As long as people dont start dropping their 'drawers' in the street !!
Thatll be a bigger fine.
As long as people dont start dropping their 'drawers' in the street !!
Thatll be a bigger fine.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 6:08pm Thu 13 Dec 07
EX LABOUR VOTER AND ANYONE WHO WANTS TO ACCESS LINKS, HERE'S WHAT TO DO:
[bold]copy all[/bold] of the link. Open a new message in your mail client. Paste the link onto the new message. You can easily reassemble the link so that it works.
EX LABOUR VOTER AND ANYONE WHO WANTS TO ACCESS LINKS, HERE'S WHAT TO DO:
copy all of the link. Open a new message in your mail client. Paste the link onto the new message. You can easily reassemble the link so that it works.
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 6:28pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts![/quote] Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.[/quote] Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much![/quote] John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!!
john wrote:
Scottish Rose wrote: john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much!
John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!!
Posted by: Ladofglas25, Glasgow on 6:31pm Thu 13 Dec 07
well well, where do i start! loyal eveing times reader for about 7 years but heres what youve forced you loyal readers to communicate to you!
HAVING THE LICENCE TO PRODUCE A NEWSPAPER IS NOT A LICENCE TO SLANDER AND PUBLIC PERSECUTION, YOUVE STEPPED OVER THE LINE, there are rapes, drive by shootings and neds slashng at will in this city and your naming and disclosing PERSONAL DETAILS of someone who drops a sweetie paper is nothin short of a f**king disgrace! you are also putting the public at conciderable risk by publishing thier names and addresses, are you going to admint your actions are still justified when people (quite rightly) start to blame you for being an accesory to thier identity being stolen , ah dont think so! message to other (former) readers, if you feel as strongly as this and you think that its the job of the media to INFORM the public of current events as opposed to acting like the paper equivilent of a nazi stormtropper
1. stop buying the paper.
2 email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.
it will soon stop believe me!
PS ah wid nae wipe ma erse wi yer paper!
well well, where do i start! loyal eveing times reader for about 7 years but heres what youve forced you loyal readers to communicate to you!
HAVING THE LICENCE TO PRODUCE A NEWSPAPER IS NOT A LICENCE TO SLANDER AND PUBLIC PERSECUTION, YOUVE STEPPED OVER THE LINE, there are rapes, drive by shootings and neds slashng at will in this city and your naming and disclosing PERSONAL DETAILS of someone who drops a sweetie paper is nothin short of a f**king disgrace! you are also putting the public at conciderable risk by publishing thier names and addresses, are you going to admint your actions are still justified when people (quite rightly) start to blame you for being an accesory to thier identity being stolen , ah dont think so! message to other (former) readers, if you feel as strongly as this and you think that its the job of the media to INFORM the public of current events as opposed to acting like the paper equivilent of a nazi stormtropper
1. stop buying the paper.
2 email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.
it will soon stop believe me!
PS ah wid nae wipe ma erse wi yer paper!
Posted by: alexparade, Glasgow on 6:32pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns..
FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat??
CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT
the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment?
SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON
the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values???
Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin
gtimes.co.uk..
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns..
FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat??
CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT
the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment?
SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON
the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values???
Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin
gtimes.co.uk..
Posted by: john, renfrew on 6:41pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts![/quote] Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.[/quote] Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much![/quote] John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!![/quote] Okay and when I visit New York, you can make sure that I dont get mugged!
Scottish Rose wrote:
john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much!
John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!!
Okay and when I visit New York, you can make sure that I dont get mugged!
Posted by: People Power, Glasgow on 7:07pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]yerauldda[/bold] wrote:
we should all dump our weeks rubbish on their office door then burn it fight the power![/quote]
Nice one yerauldda,
"Power To The People." Let em have it!
Time Our Media took the blame for the problem too - as their hype of the situation, with little support in a more positive way does nothing to clean our streets.
Why not have the Evening Times giving away free dustpans or brushes and shovels - better still - a free litter picker to every reader!
Now thats what I call being Pro-active!!!
Come on E.T. show us what your made of ? ?
yerauldda wrote:
we should all dump our weeks rubbish on their office door then burn it fight the power!
Nice one yerauldda,
"Power To The People." Let em have it!
Time Our Media took the blame for the problem too - as their hype of the situation, with little support in a more positive way does nothing to clean our streets.
Why not have the Evening Times giving away free dustpans or brushes and shovels - better still - a free litter picker to every reader!
Now thats what I call being Pro-active!!!
Come on E.T. show us what your made of ? ?
Posted by: yerauldda, West End Exile on 7:15pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]alexparade[/bold] wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..[/quote] thats the funniest thing i've read in years
alexparade wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..
thats the funniest thing i've read in years
Posted by: Scottish Rose, U.S.A. on 7:29pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]Scottish Rose[/bold] wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!![/quote] More like a drink after reading your posts![/quote] Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.[/quote] Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much![/quote] John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!![/quote] Okay and when I visit New York, you can make sure that I dont get mugged![/quote] I dont live in New York John. South of Michigan, East of Chicago, North of West Virginia, and then West of New York. I'll let you do the geography, since you seem to be very smart. So be careful in N.Y. I wont be there to help you! I guess you just took for granted all Scottish people move to N.Y. That's ok. Most people here think ALL Scots have red hair. I forgive you.
john wrote:
Scottish Rose wrote: john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: john wrote: Scottish Rose wrote: Now, now. Be nice, it's almost Xmas John. Lighten up. Noo go make yersel a wee cup of tea!!
More like a drink after reading your posts!
Your RIGHT that IS more like it. But I thought i would give you the benefit of the doubt. You said it...NOT me.
Please, dont give me the benefit of the doubt. You can continue insulting me with you sidekick. Oh and please continue with you assenine posts. Thanks very much!
John. Just YOU make sure it's nice and CLEAN next time I fly into Glasgow...Thank you!!
Okay and when I visit New York, you can make sure that I dont get mugged!
I dont live in New York John. South of Michigan, East of Chicago, North of West Virginia, and then West of New York. I'll let you do the geography, since you seem to be very smart. So be careful in N.Y. I wont be there to help you! I guess you just took for granted all Scottish people move to N.Y. That's ok. Most people here think ALL Scots have red hair. I forgive you.
Posted by: Jwil, Lanarkshire on 9:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
And while you are at it why don't the Evening times name and shame those bureaucrats who think up politically correct rules and health and safety rules which are over the top?
And while you are at it why don't the Evening times name and shame those bureaucrats who think up politically correct rules and health and safety rules which are over the top?
Posted by: Alex, Glasgow on 9:16pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Whilst I agree the litter droppers deserve a fine for doing so, I am puzzled as to why that particular group of law breakers have got on the wrong side of the Times. Why is it we dont see any naming & shaming of those who pass through the Sheriff court, for example. Or is house breaking, car thieving or those of that ilk a socially aceptable conviction?
The Times used to have a reputation of being the most socially responsible newspaper in Scotland, now it's becoming as poor as the Record and that other rag that used to be printed in Portman St.
Shame on them!
Whilst I agree the litter droppers deserve a fine for doing so, I am puzzled as to why that particular group of law breakers have got on the wrong side of the Times. Why is it we dont see any naming & shaming of those who pass through the Sheriff court, for example. Or is house breaking, car thieving or those of that ilk a socially aceptable conviction?
The Times used to have a reputation of being the most socially responsible newspaper in Scotland, now it's becoming as poor as the Record and that other rag that used to be printed in Portman St.
Shame on them!
Posted by: AshleyM, Ayrshire on 10:01pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Well Evening Times, as you have no decent stories to report on this week, we think will just name some silly litter bugs, half of which have prob thrown away your crap paper. Actually just wanted to point out next time I`m named and shamed in your paper for something which i didnt do on purpose, will you try and spell my name correctly. Typical weegie paper, uneducated morons who cant even spell correctly.
Well Evening Times, as you have no decent stories to report on this week, we think will just name some silly litter bugs, half of which have prob thrown away your crap paper. Actually just wanted to point out next time I`m named and shamed in your paper for something which i didnt do on purpose, will you try and spell my name correctly. Typical weegie paper, uneducated morons who cant even spell correctly.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 10:05pm Thu 13 Dec 07
The ET mentioned NEXUS naming and shaming fare dodgers. This another distortion of the truth. I spoke to a representative of NEXUS. For legal reasons, they cannot name people who have paid a fixed penalty. They are only allowed to publish details of those convicted in court.
ET, just like your bogus poll and your suggestion that you have popular support this is MORE lies and more destortion.
SACK MARIANNE TAYLOR AND HER EDITOR!!!!!
The ET mentioned NEXUS naming and shaming fare dodgers. This another distortion of the truth. I spoke to a representative of NEXUS. For legal reasons, they cannot name people who have paid a fixed penalty. They are only allowed to publish details of those convicted in court.
ET, just like your bogus poll and your suggestion that you have popular support this is MORE lies and more destortion.
SACK MARIANNE TAYLOR AND HER EDITOR!!!!!
Posted by: AshleyM, Stewarton on 10:15pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]alexparade[/bold] wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..[/quote] My whole family are in tears, laughing at that. Maybe you could be the new ET editor. You would be a hell of alot better.
alexparade wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..
My whole family are in tears, laughing at that. Maybe you could be the new ET editor. You would be a hell of alot better.
Posted by: AshleyM, Stewarton on 10:17pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]alexparade[/bold] wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..[/quote] My whole family are in tears, laughing at that. Maybe you could be the new ET editor. You would be a hell of alot better.
alexparade wrote:
Here is an exclusive preview of Marianne Taylor and Donald Martin's forthcoming campaigns.. FATTIES EXPOSED - we name and shame Glasgow's 2000 most obese people, and ask them - Just why the hell are you all so fat?? CANCER DEATHS - YOU DESERVED IT the Evening Times and Scottish Executive dig up the bodies of people who died of smoking related diseases, and ask their relatives - when will you pay back the taxpayer for years of NHS treatment? SINGLE MUMS - KEEP YOUR KNICKERS ON the Evening Jackboot and friends go undercover at a family planning clinic, name and shame unmarried women attending, then ask them - where are your Christian values??? Any more suggestions would be gratefully accepted, just email donald.martin@evenin gtimes.co.uk..
My whole family are in tears, laughing at that. Maybe you could be the new ET editor. You would be a hell of alot better.
Posted by: Heather, Glasgow on 10:18pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote]email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.[/quote]
One of the areas is of the PCC code is "accuracy", and the information which John has just provided means the accuracy rule applies to the Nexus quote. The fact that they are using one violation of the code to justify two further violations of the code is perverse. John, I would suggest that you file a complaint with the PCC, and do it quickly before the ET magically changes the story and selectively deletes reader posts.
http://www.pcc.org.u
k/complaints/process
.html
email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.
One of the areas is of the PCC code is "accuracy", and the information which John has just provided means the accuracy rule applies to the Nexus quote. The fact that they are using one violation of the code to justify two further violations of the code is perverse. John, I would suggest that you file a complaint with the PCC, and do it quickly before the ET magically changes the story and selectively deletes reader posts.
http://www.pcc.org.u
k/complaints/process
.html
Posted by: George Brown, glasgow on 10:18pm Thu 13 Dec 07
the times is no better than any other paper
it uses the same time honoured excuse as every other rag 'it's all in the public interest'
is it really in the public interest when an unfortunate 'idol' or 'star' falling from grace is hounded by press? is that not likely to compound a victim's problems when a little common sense and privacy could enable recovery equally is it really in the public interest when a celebrity is pursued by press when all they want is a quiet holiday somewhere? and at the very extreme end what about the public interest as to where and what the late Princess Di and friend were doing
Are any of the ET staff prepared to give us a run down as to where they stay and invite 'Joe public' to follow them and familly about on a daily basis to dig up some muck where ever they go?
all in the public interest of course!
the times is no better than any other paper
it uses the same time honoured excuse as every other rag 'it's all in the public interest'
is it really in the public interest when an unfortunate 'idol' or 'star' falling from grace is hounded by press? is that not likely to compound a victim's problems when a little common sense and privacy could enable recovery equally is it really in the public interest when a celebrity is pursued by press when all they want is a quiet holiday somewhere? and at the very extreme end what about the public interest as to where and what the late Princess Di and friend were doing
Are any of the ET staff prepared to give us a run down as to where they stay and invite 'Joe public' to follow them and familly about on a daily basis to dig up some muck where ever they go?
all in the public interest of course!
Posted by: IainGlasgow07, glasgow on 10:41pm Thu 13 Dec 07
I never thought it possible but the ET has finally descended to the level of journalism produced by the Daily Retard.
What will it be a list of next? People who have received speeding tickets? parking tickets? Summary warrants for non-payment of council tax? Fines for watching TV without a licence? Drink Driving convictions?
I never thought it possible but the ET has finally descended to the level of journalism produced by the Daily Retard.
What will it be a list of next? People who have received speeding tickets? parking tickets? Summary warrants for non-payment of council tax? Fines for watching TV without a licence? Drink Driving convictions?
Posted by: john, renfrew on 10:44pm Thu 13 Dec 07
[quote][bold]Heather[/bold] wrote:
[quote]email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.[/quote] One of the areas is of the PCC code is "accuracy", and the information which John has just provided means the accuracy rule applies to the Nexus quote. The fact that they are using one violation of the code to justify two further violations of the code is perverse. John, I would suggest that you file a complaint with the PCC, and do it quickly before the ET magically changes the story and selectively deletes reader posts. http://www.pcc.org.u k/complaints/process .html[/quote] Heather, NEXUS said that it doesnt publish names of fare dodgers who pay fines to inspectors. The guy I spoke to wasnt entirely sure of the legal reason, one reason could be that a fine in this instance constitutes 'a fare'. The reason could also be that there is no admitted liabilty nor guilt. In which case, both the ET and GCC are on really shaky ground. At the very least, it does represent an intentional distortion of the facts.
Nexus does only publish names of people who have been to court.
I will repost a letter I emailed to Wendy Alexander, it will let you see how dodgy GCC's position is.
Oh and Heather thanks for your earlier very informative posts.
Heather wrote:
email your local MP AND the Press complaints Commision with an official complaint to the actions of this newspaper.
One of the areas is of the PCC code is "accuracy", and the information which John has just provided means the accuracy rule applies to the Nexus quote. The fact that they are using one violation of the code to justify two further violations of the code is perverse. John, I would suggest that you file a complaint with the PCC, and do it quickly before the ET magically changes the story and selectively deletes reader posts. http://www.pcc.org.u k/complaints/process .html
Heather, NEXUS said that it doesnt publish names of fare dodgers who pay fines to inspectors. The guy I spoke to wasnt entirely sure of the legal reason, one reason could be that a fine in this instance constitutes 'a fare'. The reason could also be that there is no admitted liabilty nor guilt. In which case, both the ET and GCC are on really shaky ground. At the very least, it does represent an intentional distortion of the facts.
Nexus does only publish names of people who have been to court.
I will repost a letter I emailed to Wendy Alexander, it will let you see how dodgy GCC's position is.
Oh and Heather thanks for your earlier very informative posts.
Posted by: IainGlasgow07, glasgow on 10:47pm Thu 13 Dec 07
If someone on this list gets something like "litterbug" spray-painted on their front door or the side of their house will the Evening Times be paying for it to be cleaned off?
If someone on this list gets something like "litterbug" spray-painted on their front door or the side of their house will the Evening Times be paying for it to be cleaned off?
Posted by: john, renfrew on 10:47pm Thu 13 Dec 07
Dear Ms Alexander,
I was shocked to notice in yesterday's Glasgow Evening Times that the names and addresses of people who had been fined for littering had been published.
These names and address were provided by Glasgow City Council and are also available on its website.
I certainly do not condon littering and I agree that transgessors should be punished. But, these people have already been fined, I feel that this is the modern equivalent of being 'put in the stocks'. A practice long outlawed since the end of medieval thinking (or so I thought).
Furthermore, under Scottish Statutory Instrument 2004 No. 427: The Litter (Fixed Penalty Notices) (Scotland) Order 2004 paying a fixed penalty notice is in itself a conviction nor admission of guilt: this notice offers you the opportunity of discharging any liability to conviction for that offence by payment of a fixed penalty. The instrument goes on, adding: No proceedings will be taken for this offence before the expiration of fourteen days following the date of this notice.
People who have paid the fixed penalty have commited no crime, have admitted no guilt and in fact are innocent in legal terms. In publishing the names AND addresses their Civil Liberties have been infringed upon. Additional, the Data Protection Act has been broken.
I addressed my concerns to a representative of Glasgow Council legal services, Dr Kenny Maughan. We spoke on the telephone. Dr Maughan justified the actions of Glasgow City Council in: The Environment Protection Act 1990 (c. 43), section 87, subparagraph 6. This states:
(6) A local authority, with a view to promoting the abatement of litter, may take such steps as the authority think appropriate for making the effect of subsection (5) above known to the public in their area.
Now, refering back to subsection (5) as mentioned above:
(5) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
However, in paying a fixed penalty, a person is not deemed to be guilty!!!! So, legally Glasgow Council have no justification and are in fact breaking many laws.
They plan to publish more names and address! A lot of these people may not have intentionaly dropped litter at all! The Wardens give the public no second chance to pick anything they dropped up and will recieve payment under duress! Have you never accidently dropped something on the street?
How will the Scottish Nation look when a visitor picks up a Newspaper and reads this? Is this whole campagn not just stupid and petty. How many extra policemen would all this have paid for? Surely, the Police are empowered to prevent littering AS well as making the streets safer??? No, this ill-advised PR exercise is considered better. How do these Council Leaders get elected?
I respectfully ask, that you please, please do something about this. Its making me embarassed to be Scottish!!!!
Regards,
Dear Ms Alexander,
I was shocked to notice in yesterday's Glasgow Evening Times that the names and addresses of people who had been fined for littering had been published.
These names and address were provided by Glasgow City Council and are also available on its website.
I certainly do not condon littering and I agree that transgessors should be punished. But, these people have already been fined, I feel that this is the modern equivalent of being 'put in the stocks'. A practice long outlawed since the end of medieval thinking (or so I thought).
Furthermore, under Scottish Statutory Instrument 2004 No. 427: The Litter (Fixed Penalty Notices) (Scotland) Order 2004 paying a fixed penalty notice is in itself a conviction nor admission of guilt: this notice offers you the opportunity of discharging any liability to conviction for that offence by payment of a fixed penalty. The instrument goes on, adding: No proceedings will be taken for this offence before the expiration of fourteen days following the date of this notice.
People who have paid the fixed penalty have commited no crime, have admitted no guilt and in fact are innocent in legal terms. In publishing the names AND addresses their Civil Liberties have been infringed upon. Additional, the Data Protection Act has been broken.
I addressed my concerns to a representative of Glasgow Council legal services, Dr Kenny Maughan. We spoke on the telephone. Dr Maughan justified the actions of Glasgow City Council in: The Environment Protection Act 1990 (c. 43), section 87, subparagraph 6. This states:
(6) A local authority, with a view to promoting the abatement of litter, may take such steps as the authority think appropriate for making the effect of subsection (5) above known to the public in their area.
Now, refering back to subsection (5) as mentioned above:
(5) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
However, in paying a fixed penalty, a person is not deemed to be guilty!!!! So, legally Glasgow Council have no justification and are in fact breaking many laws.
They plan to publish more names and address! A lot of these people may not have intentionaly dropped litter at all! The Wardens give the public no second chance to pick anything they dropped up and will recieve payment under duress! Have you never accidently dropped something on the street?
How will the Scottish Nation look when a visitor picks up a Newspaper and reads this? Is this whole campagn not just stupid and petty. How many extra policemen would all this have paid for? Surely, the Police are empowered to prevent littering AS well as making the streets safer??? No, this ill-advised PR exercise is considered better. How do these Council Leaders get elected?
I respectfully ask, that you please, please do something about this. Its making me embarassed to be Scottish!!!!
Regards,
Posted by: john, renfrew on 10:58pm Thu 13 Dec 07
A correction to my earlier post, this line should read: paying a fixed penalty notice is in [bold]not[/bold] itself a conviction nor admission of guilt: this notice offers you the opportunity of discharging any liability to....
A correction to my earlier post, this line should read: paying a fixed penalty notice is in
not itself a conviction nor admission of guilt: this notice offers you the opportunity of discharging any liability to....
Posted by: DavidJames, United States on 12:01am Fri 14 Dec 07
What right does the Evening Times have to breach the Data Protection Act? Are the nazis running glasgow that insecure? I urge everyone who is names to take both Glasgow and ET to court.
Until these **** are taken to task this is going to continue, stand up for your rights Glasgow.
What right does the Evening Times have to breach the Data Protection Act? Are the nazis running glasgow that insecure? I urge everyone who is names to take both Glasgow and ET to court.
Until these **** are taken to task this is going to continue, stand up for your rights Glasgow.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 12:09am Fri 14 Dec 07
[quote][bold]DavidJames[/bold] wrote:
What right does the Evening Times have to breach the Data Protection Act? Are the nazis running glasgow that insecure? I urge everyone who is names to take both Glasgow and ET to court. Until these **** are taken to task this is going to continue, stand up for your rights Glasgow.[/quote] DavidJames, that was a point I made in an earlier post. What would a visitor to this country think about all this pettiness. You have just answered my question.
DavidJames wrote:
What right does the Evening Times have to breach the Data Protection Act? Are the nazis running glasgow that insecure? I urge everyone who is names to take both Glasgow and ET to court. Until these **** are taken to task this is going to continue, stand up for your rights Glasgow.
DavidJames, that was a point I made in an earlier post. What would a visitor to this country think about all this pettiness. You have just answered my question.
Posted by: DavidJames, United States on 12:25am Fri 14 Dec 07
I'm from Glasgow originally but moved to the US several years ago. I'm appalled by the ET pulling a stunt like this and embarrassed to have been a Times reader for most of my life in the UK. Everyone named who has the means should fight this blatant invasion of privacy in the courts. The morons in power have to learn that this is not a police state. And they are not above the law.
I'm from Glasgow originally but moved to the US several years ago. I'm appalled by the ET pulling a stunt like this and embarrassed to have been a Times reader for most of my life in the UK. Everyone named who has the means should fight this blatant invasion of privacy in the courts. The morons in power have to learn that this is not a police state. And they are not above the law.
Posted by: mimrdfd, Western Australia on 12:26am Fri 14 Dec 07
I must congratulate the Evening Times on your stand against litterbugs. Myself and my family visited Glasgow three years ago(my famiy's first visit) and we were dismayed at the amount of litter that we witnessed in and around the city centre. As 'tourists' it left a rather bad image on our minds so any improvement would be a great step in the right direction. WELL DONE
I must congratulate the Evening Times on your stand against litterbugs. Myself and my family visited Glasgow three years ago(my famiy's first visit) and we were dismayed at the amount of litter that we witnessed in and around the city centre. As 'tourists' it left a rather bad image on our minds so any improvement would be a great step in the right direction. WELL DONE
Posted by: Johnny Punchclock, Glasgow on 12:33am Fri 14 Dec 07
[quote][bold]IainGlasgow07[/bold] wrote:
What will it be a list of next? People who have received speeding tickets? parking tickets? Summary warrants for non-payment of council tax? Fines for watching TV without a licence? Drink Driving convictions?[/quote]
Yes, please. I think this would be a good thing, and since I have fallen into more than one of these categories in my time (not drink-driving, let me make it clear!) I would be prepared to take my medicine with the rest of them.
IainGlasgow07 wrote:
What will it be a list of next? People who have received speeding tickets? parking tickets? Summary warrants for non-payment of council tax? Fines for watching TV without a licence? Drink Driving convictions?
Yes, please. I think this would be a good thing, and since I have fallen into more than one of these categories in my time (not drink-driving, let me make it clear!) I would be prepared to take my medicine with the rest of them.
Posted by: john, renfrew on 12:52am Fri 14 Dec 07
[quote][bold]DavidJames[/bold] wrote:
I'm from Glasgow originally but moved to the US several years ago. I'm appalled by the ET pulling a stunt like this and embarrassed to have been a Times reader for most of my life in the UK. Everyone named who has the means should fight this blatant invasion of privacy in the courts. The morons in power have to learn that this is not a police state. And they are not above the law.[/quote] Well, I stopped reading the Evening Times when they published the names and addresses of people who hadnt paid their tv license (tax?). Yes, IainGlasgow07, they have already done that. And mimrdfd of Western australia, I would say to you, that all this is is a PR excercise ie its politically motivated. If it wasnt, then they could have employed police instead of litter wardens. Correct my here, but cannot police arrest litterers AS WELL AS making the streets safer?
All this is petty small minded tattle taleing from a stupid little paper that will alienate most of its readers!
DavidJames wrote:
I'm from Glasgow originally but moved to the US several years ago. I'm appalled by the ET pulling a stunt like this and embarrassed to have been a Times reader for most of my life in the UK. Everyone named who has the means should fight this blatant invasion of privacy in the courts. The morons in power have to learn that this is not a police state. And they are not above the law.
Well, I stopped reading the Evening Times when they published the names and addresses of people who hadnt paid their tv license (tax?). Yes, IainGlasgow07, they have already done that. And mimrdfd of Western australia, I would say to you, that all this is is a PR excercise ie its politically motivated. If it wasnt, then they could have employed police instead of litter wardens. Correct my here, but cannot police arrest litterers AS WELL AS making the streets safer?
All this is petty small minded tattle taleing from a stupid little paper that will alienate most of its readers!
Posted by: john, renfrew on 1:03am Fri 14 Dec 07
PS, ignor Johny Punchclock everyone, he's really Cllr Purcell's right hand man hahahaha
PS, ignor Johny Punchclock everyone, he's really Cllr Purcell's right hand man hahahaha
Posted by: lisak22, glasgow on 9:36am Fri 14 Dec 07
there should be no namimg and shaming of the litter louts they have paid there fine end of ET get a grip and write about the important stuff and if you really want to name and shame people why not name and shame rapists, drug dealers, robbers or benefit theifs. the evening times has changed it used to be a good paper for glasgow residents giving the important news about the goings on in glasgow this is not that important as the article says they have heard from people who have been fined and have learned there lesson so what is the need??. this paper (or the people behind it) really need to be brought down a few pegs.
ps. i am not a litter lout but think it is disgusting what this paper is doing.
there should be no namimg and shaming of the litter louts they have paid there fine end of ET get a grip and write about the important stuff and if you really want to name and shame people why not name and shame rapists, drug dealers, robbers or benefit theifs. the evening times has changed it used to be a good paper for glasgow residents giving the important news about the goings on in glasgow this is not that important as the article says they have heard from people who have been fined and have learned there lesson so what is the need??. this paper (or the people behind it) really need to be brought down a few pegs.
ps. i am not a litter lout but think it is disgusting what this paper is doing.
Posted by: Johnny Punchclock, Glasgow on 9:44am Fri 14 Dec 07
[quote][bold]john[/bold] wrote:
PS, ignor Johny Punchclock everyone, he's really Cllr Purcell's right hand man hahahaha[/quote] That was a bit personal. And untrue. And from someone so worried about defamation, a bit hypocritical. It sounds as if you've run out of argument so you're playing the man, not the ball.
john wrote:
PS, ignor Johny Punchclock everyone, he's really Cllr Purcell's right hand man hahahaha
That was a bit personal. And untrue. And from someone so worried about defamation, a bit hypocritical. It sounds as if you've run out of argument so you're playing the man, not the ball.
Posted by: Sydney Meriwether, At home on 10:43am Fri 14 Dec 07
Don't take it so personally Johnny P, you've been rumbled, but we all have a job to do... chin up and I'm sure you'll see it through!
Don't take it so personally Johnny P, you've been rumbled, but we all have a job to do... chin up and I'm sure you'll see it through!
Posted by: trench, possilpark on 4:57pm Fri 14 Dec 07
the parents also should be involved in clean ups as their children can not be named and shamed(there is a law not allowing identities of children under a certain age to be published,)maybe there should be extra tax put on the household where the messy kids live?.
the parents also should be involved in clean ups as their children can not be named and shamed(there is a law not allowing identities of children under a certain age to be published,)maybe there should be extra tax put on the household where the messy kids live?.
Posted by: LA, greece on 5:15pm Fri 14 Dec 07
No longer in Scotland im in shock at this but not that surprised.I read the times everyday online but it really reminds me of just why i left the country.Thank god im no longer,i like my blood pressure kept low thank you very much.Pathetic!
No longer in Scotland im in shock at this but not that surprised.I read the times everyday online but it really reminds me of just why i left the country.Thank god im no longer,i like my blood pressure kept low thank you very much.Pathetic!
Posted by: jsm, Glasgow on 4:26am Tue 18 Dec 07
yep glasgow's a beautiful city just dont look at the ground
yep glasgow's a beautiful city just dont look at the ground
Posted by: rmackay2, vancouver bc on 6:13pm Sat 15 Nov 08
To me Glasgow is one of the most beautiful Cities anywhere, I admit it needs improvements, my wife and I were at the Mitchell Library and some of these back streets were not to good ,newspapers etc.The Glasgow council should go to Oahu (Hawaii) and along the streets on Waikiki, the hotel section which is a very busy place you could eat off the streets, the Glasgow council should follow their tactics, as for the rat prblem bring back Dick McTaggart
To me Glasgow is one of the most beautiful Cities anywhere, I admit it needs improvements, my wife and I were at the Mitchell Library and some of these back streets were not to good ,newspapers etc.The Glasgow council should go to Oahu (Hawaii) and along the streets on Waikiki, the hotel section which is a very busy place you could eat off the streets, the Glasgow council should follow their tactics, as for the rat prblem bring back Dick McTaggart
Posted by: rmackay2, vancouver bc on 6:33pm Sat 15 Nov 08
To Scottish Rose & John, keep up the banter, it's entertaining, to Rose have you ever been to Macy's Parade, or Times Square at the bells, as far as I am concerned,only two places to be at the Bells George's Square or Times Square, A Merry Xmas and a giud New Year to you both
To Scottish Rose & John, keep up the banter, it's entertaining, to Rose have you ever been to Macy's Parade, or Times Square at the bells, as far as I am concerned,only two places to be at the Bells George's Square or Times Square, A Merry Xmas and a giud New Year to you both
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