Posted by: andy3127, Troon on 11:24am Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote]The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.[/quote]
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats!
The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats!
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 11:26am Tue 29 Jul 08
Its despicable to know that slum landlords have been getting away with this sort of thing for years - greedy b'stards who have no morals whatsoever.
Collectively they have ruined places like Govanhill and other areas of Glasgow in the past and the Labour controlled authorities have let them away with it.
Its not surprising that those in control have got away with it, they are the root cause as to why this practice has flourished.
Its despicable to know that slum landlords have been getting away with this sort of thing for years - greedy b'stards who have no morals whatsoever.
Collectively they have ruined places like Govanhill and other areas of Glasgow in the past and the Labour controlled authorities have let them away with it.
Its not surprising that those in control have got away with it, they are the root cause as to why this practice has flourished.
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 11:30am Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]andy3127[/bold] wrote:
[quote]The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.[/quote] Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats![/quote] Flats with no shops and basically a housing scheme with nothing in it except cardboard houses.
Considering the existing property if rehabilitated could fetch average prices of around £80-£100,000. I see that it is worthwhile investing in such property, shame we have little of this property left in the Inner City, which is being degraded to slum conditions.
If you disagree then why preserve Shawlands or the West End, if its good enough for Govanhill to be wiped out as people would claim, then its good enough for the West End and Shawlands, same type of property, dispose of the lot and lets see where this leaves Glasgow as a city!
Joke!
andy3127 wrote:
The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats!
Flats with no shops and basically a housing scheme with nothing in it except cardboard houses.
Considering the existing property if rehabilitated could fetch average prices of around £80-£100,000. I see that it is worthwhile investing in such property, shame we have little of this property left in the Inner City, which is being degraded to slum conditions.
If you disagree then why preserve Shawlands or the West End, if its good enough for Govanhill to be wiped out as people would claim, then its good enough for the West End and Shawlands, same type of property, dispose of the lot and lets see where this leaves Glasgow as a city!
Joke!
Posted by: glamkitty, Glasgow on 11:31am Tue 29 Jul 08
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street.
Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again.
So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street.
Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again.
So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 11:48am Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]glamkitty[/bold] wrote:
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.[/quote] I see this everywherte, people can't be bothered to phone the depot for bulk refuse, probebly scared in case there is a charge for the service, so they do what people in Glasgow have been doing for years.
Simply dump their stuff on the street.
With regards to the state of properties, I doubt that it is the fault of tenants who choose to live in such squalor, mind you it has been hidden for years with people believing that such conditions did not exist anymore.
You live in Dennistoun, I'm sure you have the same problem up there, does that mean you wish to see your area flattened as well?
glamkitty wrote:
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
I see this everywherte, people can't be bothered to phone the depot for bulk refuse, probebly scared in case there is a charge for the service, so they do what people in Glasgow have been doing for years.
Simply dump their stuff on the street.
With regards to the state of properties, I doubt that it is the fault of tenants who choose to live in such squalor, mind you it has been hidden for years with people believing that such conditions did not exist anymore.
You live in Dennistoun, I'm sure you have the same problem up there, does that mean you wish to see your area flattened as well?
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 11:51am Tue 29 Jul 08
It looks as if the solution should be that people should go back to living in caves, there is an element of people who live in such areas that wish to see them disposed of.
I know of people who live in DSS houses in King's Park and Simshill, that brings the reputation of the area down, does that mean these areas should be flattened as well?
Hardly conceivable, but some people only care about themselves, rather than look at the bigger picture.
Glasgow is going down the pan.
It looks as if the solution should be that people should go back to living in caves, there is an element of people who live in such areas that wish to see them disposed of.
I know of people who live in DSS houses in King's Park and Simshill, that brings the reputation of the area down, does that mean these areas should be flattened as well?
Hardly conceivable, but some people only care about themselves, rather than look at the bigger picture.
Glasgow is going down the pan.
Posted by: Stereotypical Glaswegian, Glasgow on 11:52am Tue 29 Jul 08
I wonder how much could be raised for repair and rehab of the properties if the assets of the landlords were seized?
I see no reason why [bold]ANY[/bold] taxpayers money be spent on this.
I wonder how much could be raised for repair and rehab of the properties if the assets of the landlords were seized?
I see no reason why
ANY taxpayers money be spent on this.
Posted by: Stereotypical Glaswegian, Glasgow on 12:04pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]glamkitty[/bold] wrote:
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street.
Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again.
So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.[/quote] All these problems could be minimised if the law was implemented.
Housing benefit officials, liscencing boards, etc., if they all — down the line — implemented the law this problem would never have been allowed to develop.
Political correct brainwashing is destroying Glasgow.
glamkitty wrote:
Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street.
Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again.
So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
All these problems could be minimised if the law was implemented.
Housing benefit officials, liscencing boards, etc., if they all — down the line — implemented the law this problem would never have been allowed to develop.
Political correct brainwashing is destroying Glasgow.
Posted by: The Missing City, Glasgow on 12:08pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]Stereotypical Glaswegian[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]glamkitty[/bold] wrote: Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.[/quote] All these problems could be minimised if the law was implemented. Housing benefit officials, liscencing boards, etc., if they all — down the line — implemented the law this problem would never have been allowed to develop. Political correct brainwashing is destroying Glasgow.[/quote] [bold]Glasgow is key to the future of Labour[/bold]
[quote]Cathy Jamieson, one of the front-runners for the Scottish Labour Party leadership, said current efforts "to rejuvenate and regenerate" the city were "superb".[/quote]
That's why most of the city outside the tourist spots remains forgotten and has degenerated into squalor for decades and together with the Tory employment scandal of the 80's, they have both turned decent people into filthy rougues, criminalised and fit for a criminal career.
For that, I will never trust these parties again.
[bold]Good shout Stereotypical Glaswegian ;-)[/bold]
Stereotypical Glaswegian wrote:
glamkitty wrote: Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
All these problems could be minimised if the law was implemented. Housing benefit officials, liscencing boards, etc., if they all — down the line — implemented the law this problem would never have been allowed to develop. Political correct brainwashing is destroying Glasgow.
Glasgow is key to the future of Labour
Cathy Jamieson, one of the front-runners for the Scottish Labour Party leadership, said current efforts "to rejuvenate and regenerate" the city were "superb".
That's why most of the city outside the tourist spots remains forgotten and has degenerated into squalor for decades and together with the Tory employment scandal of the 80's, they have both turned decent people into filthy rougues, criminalised and fit for a criminal career.
For that, I will never trust these parties again.
Good shout Stereotypical Glaswegian ;-) Posted by: bluey, glasgow on 12:10pm Tue 29 Jul 08
The notion of jailing rogue landlords is laughable - very few bad landlords have ever been imprisoned for breaking housing law, at most a handful who have killed their tenants through lack of compliance with health and safety. Even those taken to court for persistently breaching HMO regulations get a slap on the wrist or modest fine.
The notion of jailing rogue landlords is laughable - very few bad landlords have ever been imprisoned for breaking housing law, at most a handful who have killed their tenants through lack of compliance with health and safety. Even those taken to court for persistently breaching HMO regulations get a slap on the wrist or modest fine.
Posted by: John Rendall, Glasgow on 12:56pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]andy3127[/bold] wrote:
[quote]The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.[/quote]
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats![/quote] I think you will find to build 100 affordable houses would cost in the region of £12million. People also want to live in teh communities they have grown up in so investing in current homes is something that has to be looked at.
andy3127 wrote:
The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats!
I think you will find to build 100 affordable houses would cost in the region of £12million. People also want to live in teh communities they have grown up in so investing in current homes is something that has to be looked at.
Posted by: glamkitty, Glasgow on 1:00pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]The Missing City[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]glamkitty[/bold] wrote: Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.[/quote] I see this everywherte, people can't be bothered to phone the depot for bulk refuse, probebly scared in case there is a charge for the service, so they do what people in Glasgow have been doing for years. Simply dump their stuff on the street. With regards to the state of properties, I doubt that it is the fault of tenants who choose to live in such squalor, mind you it has been hidden for years with people believing that such conditions did not exist anymore. You live in Dennistoun, I'm sure you have the same problem up there, does that mean you wish to see your area flattened as well?[/quote] We dont have problems on this scale, that Ive seen anyway - there are a decent number of people who own their homes and still care.
I didnt say I wanted to see the area flattened. I said I wanted responsibility to be shared between landlords and tenants.
Not being funny, but if my home was crawling with cockroaches, Id move out to somewhere else, or buy some insect killer. Yes the landlord has responsibility for some things, but the tenants must accept some too.
The Missing City wrote:
glamkitty wrote: Of course greedy, selfish landlords are part of the problem, but theyre not all of it. Much of the problem is down to disgusting tenants. I mean - the state of gardens like the one above, thats just sheer skanky laziness. Its not up to the landlord to put tenants rubbish in the bin, or stop them from dumping their crap in the street. Spending a fortune on a lot of these closes is pointless, because theyll just foul them up again. So target shocking landlords AND shocking tenants.
I see this everywherte, people can't be bothered to phone the depot for bulk refuse, probebly scared in case there is a charge for the service, so they do what people in Glasgow have been doing for years. Simply dump their stuff on the street. With regards to the state of properties, I doubt that it is the fault of tenants who choose to live in such squalor, mind you it has been hidden for years with people believing that such conditions did not exist anymore. You live in Dennistoun, I'm sure you have the same problem up there, does that mean you wish to see your area flattened as well?
We dont have problems on this scale, that Ive seen anyway - there are a decent number of people who own their homes and still care.
I didnt say I wanted to see the area flattened. I said I wanted responsibility to be shared between landlords and tenants.
Not being funny, but if my home was crawling with cockroaches, Id move out to somewhere else, or buy some insect killer. Yes the landlord has responsibility for some things, but the tenants must accept some too.
Posted by: Govanhill, Govanhill on 1:09pm Tue 29 Jul 08
Why should tax payers have to fork out the money to remedy a situation which should never have been allowed to happen in the first place. Make the slum landlords pay for the destruction they have caused. Also make the shopkeepers in Allison St clean up their mess.
Govanhill Housing Association see an opportunity for empire building, that is why they are now involved. Some of the low lifes they have rented to over these past few years has also added to the dreadful situation now discussed in govanhill.
Local residents have pleaded with politicians and council officials to do something about the area for at least 3 years, no organisation including the council was ever prepared to uphold the existing laws and bye laws.
Make the slum landlords pay and don't allow Govanhill Housing Association to build an even bigger empire.
Why should tax payers have to fork out the money to remedy a situation which should never have been allowed to happen in the first place. Make the slum landlords pay for the destruction they have caused. Also make the shopkeepers in Allison St clean up their mess.
Govanhill Housing Association see an opportunity for empire building, that is why they are now involved. Some of the low lifes they have rented to over these past few years has also added to the dreadful situation now discussed in govanhill.
Local residents have pleaded with politicians and council officials to do something about the area for at least 3 years, no organisation including the council was ever prepared to uphold the existing laws and bye laws.
Make the slum landlords pay and don't allow Govanhill Housing Association to build an even bigger empire.
Posted by: Stereotypical Glaswegian, Glasgow on 1:16pm Tue 29 Jul 08
glamkitty, Glasgow on 1:00pm today - [bold]"Not being funny, but if my home was crawling with cockroaches, Id move out to somewhere else, or buy some insect killer. Yes the landlord has responsibility for some things, but the tenants must accept some too."[/bold]
You would think so wouldn't you
glamkitty, Glasgow on 1:00pm today -
"Not being funny, but if my home was crawling with cockroaches, Id move out to somewhere else, or buy some insect killer. Yes the landlord has responsibility for some things, but the tenants must accept some too."
You would think so wouldn't you
Posted by: angybee, glasgow on 1:24pm Tue 29 Jul 08
G.H.A have a cheek on them as they were the worse slum landlords out.so maybe they should start with themselves.
G.H.A have a cheek on them as they were the worse slum landlords out.so maybe they should start with themselves.
Posted by: Govanhill, Govanhill on 1:32pm Tue 29 Jul 08
The flats in question have never been owned by Glasgow City Council or Govanhill Housing Association. At one time, they were good flats and if properly maintained and renovated like many tenemants in Glasgow would still be. Sadly with, "cash for flats i.e. money launering) the "buy to rent market" and the ever increasing availability of Housing Benefit (I'm sure if they had to pay from their own hard earned money they would not have been so tolerant of conditions)the social fabric of the area has changed dramatically and slum housing now exists.
How about refurbishing the flats.Decent existing owner/occupiers could remain and perhaps young working couples who may not be able to buy due to the economic climate could have the opportunity to buy into a share of home ownership.
Govanhill Housing Association sadly do not offer flats as a priority to young working couples. They have too many "social inclusion" prioritis to deal with.
These are just ideas and I am sure there are many more.
The flats in question have never been owned by Glasgow City Council or Govanhill Housing Association. At one time, they were good flats and if properly maintained and renovated like many tenemants in Glasgow would still be. Sadly with, "cash for flats i.e. money launering) the "buy to rent market" and the ever increasing availability of Housing Benefit (I'm sure if they had to pay from their own hard earned money they would not have been so tolerant of conditions)the social fabric of the area has changed dramatically and slum housing now exists.
How about refurbishing the flats.Decent existing owner/occupiers could remain and perhaps young working couples who may not be able to buy due to the economic climate could have the opportunity to buy into a share of home ownership.
Govanhill Housing Association sadly do not offer flats as a priority to young working couples. They have too many "social inclusion" prioritis to deal with.
These are just ideas and I am sure there are many more.
Posted by: bibliotecaria, East End on 1:34pm Tue 29 Jul 08
The government should look at taxing and regulating private landlords so that tenants and their often long-suffering neighbours are adequately protected from such deterioration and from anti-social behaviour. Too many amateurs and sharks have been jumping on the buy-to-let bandwagon looking for a fast buck and caring very little about the consequences of sticking any old tenant in their properties.
And why on earth are 3 adults and 8 children living in one flat? Don't parents want to have secure and comfortable homes before bringing more kids into the world?
The government should look at taxing and regulating private landlords so that tenants and their often long-suffering neighbours are adequately protected from such deterioration and from anti-social behaviour. Too many amateurs and sharks have been jumping on the buy-to-let bandwagon looking for a fast buck and caring very little about the consequences of sticking any old tenant in their properties.
And why on earth are 3 adults and 8 children living in one flat? Don't parents want to have secure and comfortable homes before bringing more kids into the world?
Posted by: Govanhill, Govanhill on 1:50pm Tue 29 Jul 08
No mention of the minister being informed of the selling of drugs openly around Allison St. or the reported "Selling of weans" up closes. I also wonder if the minister was propositioned for sexual favours or if Ms McEwan was asked if she would like to sell herself sexually.
This is typical of a day in the life of Allison St.
Many people who have lived here for years no longer feel safe in a community they were brought up in. We don't just need more uniformed police officers, we need the Vice Squad.
No mention of the minister being informed of the selling of drugs openly around Allison St. or the reported "Selling of weans" up closes. I also wonder if the minister was propositioned for sexual favours or if Ms McEwan was asked if she would like to sell herself sexually.
This is typical of a day in the life of Allison St.
Many people who have lived here for years no longer feel safe in a community they were brought up in. We don't just need more uniformed police officers, we need the Vice Squad.
Posted by: trench, possilpark on 1:55pm Tue 29 Jul 08
remember years ago the tenents would recieve a letter from the housing athorities if they did not take a turn of washing the stairs?...ah the good old days when the housing rules had to be adhered to,(and no excuses of not understanding the language).the health enforcement department should take a look at **** roaches in a back yard and have the place sprayed, also warnings sent out if they are called out once more, then....goodbye, and will be fined for causing health problems caused by filth, landlords should be taken to court and be lectured...in their own language,in front of a judge that places could be boarded up if unsafe premises are not repaired in a proper manner, checked out by health and safety inspectors....get on with it, is there anyone out there capable of implementing thse rules and conditions to these slummy filthy people?...as well as these excuses for landlords who are incapable of manageing a cess pit never mind homes that are unsuitable for human habitation.
remember years ago the tenents would recieve a letter from the housing athorities if they did not take a turn of washing the stairs?...ah the good old days when the housing rules had to be adhered to,(and no excuses of not understanding the language).the health enforcement department should take a look at **** roaches in a back yard and have the place sprayed, also warnings sent out if they are called out once more, then....goodbye, and will be fined for causing health problems caused by filth, landlords should be taken to court and be lectured...in their own language,in front of a judge that places could be boarded up if unsafe premises are not repaired in a proper manner, checked out by health and safety inspectors....get on with it, is there anyone out there capable of implementing thse rules and conditions to these slummy filthy people?...as well as these excuses for landlords who are incapable of manageing a cess pit never mind homes that are unsuitable for human habitation.
Posted by: jah1873, Glasgow, Scotland on 2:12pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]andy3127[/bold] wrote:
[quote]The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.[/quote] Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats![/quote] Here you, stop it with these good ideas. You'll embarass the council.
andy3127 wrote:
The council believes Glasgow could attract £5m of this fund - enough to repair 10 closes a year.
Ehhh....10 closes for £5 thats half a million each....whats the point in spending that much ona close where the value of all the flats in it wont reach anywhere near that amount, sounds like a bad return for an investement!!! £5million could easily build 100 affordable flats!
Here you, stop it with these good ideas. You'll embarass the council.
Posted by: John Rendall, Glasgow on 2:18pm Tue 29 Jul 08
[quote][bold]The Missing City[/bold] wrote:
Its despicable to know that slum landlords have been getting away with this sort of thing for years - greedy b'stards who have no morals whatsoever.
Collectively they have ruined places like Govanhill and other areas of Glasgow in the past and the Labour controlled authorities have let them away with it.
Its not surprising that those in control have got away with it, they are the root cause as to why this practice has flourished.[/quote] Couldn't agree more that slum landlords in this area have behaved in a despicable way. It's about time steps were taken to sort out this mess once and for all. The authorities havent been as proactive as we would all have liked but hopefully we will get action. Coul;d maybe start by making an exampple of Councillor Jahangir Hanif.
The Missing City wrote:
Its despicable to know that slum landlords have been getting away with this sort of thing for years - greedy b'stards who have no morals whatsoever.
Collectively they have ruined places like Govanhill and other areas of Glasgow in the past and the Labour controlled authorities have let them away with it.
Its not surprising that those in control have got away with it, they are the root cause as to why this practice has flourished.
Couldn't agree more that slum landlords in this area have behaved in a despicable way. It's about time steps were taken to sort out this mess once and for all. The authorities havent been as proactive as we would all have liked but hopefully we will get action. Coul;d maybe start by making an exampple of Councillor Jahangir Hanif.
Posted by: Govanhill, Govanhill on 3:05pm Tue 29 Jul 08
Glasgow City Council have undertaken a door to door survey. They now know who the slum landlords are. Perhaps we should make this information available to the public. No slum landlord should benefit financially for the destruction they have caused.
However, I am not sure if this would be acceptable under Scots Law or Sharia Law.
Glasgow City Council have undertaken a door to door survey. They now know who the slum landlords are. Perhaps we should make this information available to the public. No slum landlord should benefit financially for the destruction they have caused.
However, I am not sure if this would be acceptable under Scots Law or Sharia Law.
Posted by: fredo, paisley on 3:31pm Tue 29 Jul 08
glasgow city council pay these slum lanlords millions vote at the ballot box like the eastenders done to many clowns running the show and lining there own pockets
glasgow city council pay these slum lanlords millions vote at the ballot box like the eastenders done to many clowns running the show and lining there own pockets
Posted by: EllieL, Glasgow on 3:42pm Tue 29 Jul 08
My Granny always said "There's no such thing as slum housing - just slum people". She was talking about 1930s Gorbals, which had it's fair share of rogue landlords.
The solution has to go further than just jail for these greedy b******s. Siezure of assets and repayment of any housing benefits received in relation to these properties would be a good start. Housing benefit rules state that property has to be fit for habitation before rent can be charged and the landlord and tenant both have to confirm that it is, in the form of a written agreement - which gets copied to the Housing Benefit office. Surely letting a property knowing it to be in an uninhabitable state and coining in housing benefit from this property would fall under the description of obtaining state benefit by deception? Which, last time I looked, was a criminal offence. If this offence is shown to have been committed, assets could be siezed under the Proceeds of Crime Act. Just a thought!
This should also serve as a wake up call to all housing associations to get a grip of their tenants and start enforcing the conditions of tenancy - because when the cash cow of private rental dries up, these individuals will be coming to a housing association somewhere near you or me.
My Granny always said "There's no such thing as slum housing - just slum people". She was talking about 1930s Gorbals, which had it's fair share of rogue landlords.
The solution has to go further than just jail for these greedy b******s. Siezure of assets and repayment of any housing benefits received in relation to these properties would be a good start. Housing benefit rules state that property has to be fit for habitation before rent can be charged and the landlord and tenant both have to confirm that it is, in the form of a written agreement - which gets copied to the Housing Benefit office. Surely letting a property knowing it to be in an uninhabitable state and coining in housing benefit from this property would fall under the description of obtaining state benefit by deception? Which, last time I looked, was a criminal offence. If this offence is shown to have been committed, assets could be siezed under the Proceeds of Crime Act. Just a thought!
This should also serve as a wake up call to all housing associations to get a grip of their tenants and start enforcing the conditions of tenancy - because when the cash cow of private rental dries up, these individuals will be coming to a housing association somewhere near you or me.
Posted by: Carlos123, Hampshire on 4:11pm Tue 29 Jul 08
Let's start by delivering skips to the worst streets and let the residents help themselves by dumping all the debris from the backyards etc into the skip. How many would bother? Property owners should also be registered by the Council before they can take tenants and banned from taking rent until the flats they own are in a decent condition. Video evidence of the condition of a property at the start of a let can be used to ensure that tenants make some kind of effort to keep the place in reasonable condition once they move in. All simple stuff.
Let's start by delivering skips to the worst streets and let the residents help themselves by dumping all the debris from the backyards etc into the skip. How many would bother? Property owners should also be registered by the Council before they can take tenants and banned from taking rent until the flats they own are in a decent condition. Video evidence of the condition of a property at the start of a let can be used to ensure that tenants make some kind of effort to keep the place in reasonable condition once they move in. All simple stuff.
Posted by: Govanhill, Govanhill on 4:16pm Tue 29 Jul 08
Dear Ellie
Thank you for your post. I live in Govanhill and just like you had parents and grandparents from the Gorbals. Believe me conditions in some of these flats and closes are worse than some parts of the Gorbals of the 1960's.
Yes, just like your Gran said "There's no such thing as slum housing - just slum people". Even when the physical structure of the buildings were condemned in the Gorbals, people still knew how to take a bucket of water, a brush and some disinfectant and wash the stairs.
In some of these closes in Govanhill today any attempt by decent neighbours to comment on the lack of cleanliness within communal areas would be considered "politically incorrect", racist or a "violation of human rights" by the likes of local politicians, social workers and government officials.
We don't need new laws in Govanhill, we just need current laws and bye-laws to be implemented.
Dear Ellie
Thank you for your post. I live in Govanhill and just like you had parents and grandparents from the Gorbals. Believe me conditions in some of these flats and closes are worse than some parts of the Gorbals of the 1960's.
Yes, just like your Gran said "There's no such thing as slum housing - just slum people". Even when the physical structure of the buildings were condemned in the Gorbals, people still knew how to take a bucket of water, a brush and some disinfectant and wash the stairs.
In some of these closes in Govanhill today any attempt by decent neighbours to comment on the lack of cleanliness within communal areas would be considered "politically incorrect", racist or a "violation of human rights" by the likes of local politicians, social workers and government officials.
We don't need new laws in Govanhill, we just need current laws and bye-laws to be implemented.
Posted by: trench, possilpark on 4:47pm Tue 29 Jul 08
has anyone heard of rachman another notorious slummy landlord?, he was well known in england and not for any good reason, he was a refugee from the pow camps, came to england and bought slum property which he rented out and ripped off people by jacking up the rents,he repaid the british people who welcomed him to a peaceful life by becoming the most famous rogue landlord(i think our lot took lessons from him), the photos of some properties he had would make people nauseous....is this history repeating itself.? seize these lowlifes criminal assets plus a nice down payment for his tenents to move to somewhere decent.
has anyone heard of rachman another notorious slummy landlord?, he was well known in england and not for any good reason, he was a refugee from the pow camps, came to england and bought slum property which he rented out and ripped off people by jacking up the rents,he repaid the british people who welcomed him to a peaceful life by becoming the most famous rogue landlord(i think our lot took lessons from him), the photos of some properties he had would make people nauseous....is this history repeating itself.? seize these lowlifes criminal assets plus a nice down payment for his tenents to move to somewhere decent.
Posted by: hugo, south side on 5:00pm Tue 29 Jul 08
I firmly agree that private landlords should provide good quality rental property and that there should be both regulation and supervision of the private rented sector. However, this article reminds me of the old saying 'pot kettle and black'
Should Glasgow City Council not also be pointing the finger at GHA, some of who stock is in my view un-rentable. Until fairly recently much of this stock belonged to Glasgow City Council. So i am a bit concerned at their (councils) new found morality on the issue of slum housing.
Smacks to me of smoke and mirrors politic from the council yet again
I firmly agree that private landlords should provide good quality rental property and that there should be both regulation and supervision of the private rented sector. However, this article reminds me of the old saying 'pot kettle and black'
Should Glasgow City Council not also be pointing the finger at GHA, some of who stock is in my view un-rentable. Until fairly recently much of this stock belonged to Glasgow City Council. So i am a bit concerned at their (councils) new found morality on the issue of slum housing.
Smacks to me of smoke and mirrors politic from the council yet again
Posted by: The Wise One, Glasgow on 5:24pm Tue 29 Jul 08
Headline: 'A baby sleeps next to a swarm of cockroaches'. Shouldn't that be an 'intrusion of cockroaches'
Another excerpt."I've also heard owner-occupiers complain about how a close that was immaculate has been ruined by bad tenants - but they [bold]can't find[/bold] out who the landlords are to get work done" followed by:'Mr Webster's report also calls on the Scottish Government to establish a "recyclable capital fund" of £5million to £10m a year to let councils carry out urgent work.
Where repairs are to a privately-owned home, the cost would be claimed [bold]back from the landlord[/bold] and added back to the pot'.
Listen, either you can trace these parasites or you can't. Which is it?
Is it not the case that these slum landlords are deliberately running down the houses/closes so that the decent residents have to move out and the slum landlords can then buy these properties at discounted rates. And so the cycle goes on and on.
Finally, if the area is infested with cockroaches, I hope Environmental Health Officers are diligently checking all eating establishments and take-aways.
Bon appetit!
Headline: 'A baby sleeps next to a swarm of cockroaches'. Shouldn't that be an 'intrusion of cockroaches'
Another excerpt."I've also heard owner-occupiers complain about how a close that was immaculate has been ruined by bad tenants - but they
can't find out who the landlords are to get work done" followed by:'Mr Webster's report also calls on the Scottish Government to establish a "recyclable capital fund" of £5million to £10m a year to let councils carry out urgent work.
Where repairs are to a privately-owned home, the cost would be claimed
back from the landlord and added back to the pot'.
Listen, either you can trace these parasites or you can't. Which is it?
Is it not the case that these slum landlords are deliberately running down the houses/closes so that the decent residents have to move out and the slum landlords can then buy these properties at discounted rates. And so the cycle goes on and on.
Finally, if the area is infested with cockroaches, I hope Environmental Health Officers are diligently checking all eating establishments and take-aways.
Bon appetit!
Posted by: bluey, glasgow on 5:40pm Tue 29 Jul 08
You can trace absent landlords - all private landlords that let property in Scotland are required to register their contact details. This legislation was brought in precisely to tackle absent landlords who failed to pay for repairs and deal with their anti-social tenants.
Glasgow City Council has the powers to order tenants of unregistered landlords to stop paying them rent. The reason for this approach is that it was found that the fines issued to those breaching HMO legislation were not a deterrent to landlords, therefore the witholding of rent was designed to flush them out and hit them where it hurts - their pocket.
It may have changed now but over a year ago, Glasgow City Council had around 10,000 registered landlords but had not issued a single Rent Penalty Notice, nor had they prosecuted any landlord through this process, either.
The legislation to trace and punish landlords exists, so too, does the legislation that permits the council to issue statutory notices.
It's a case of whether the local council has the will or the resources to actually implement the rules and punishments they have at their disposal in Govanhill. The council has shut down one slum flat in the area and it seems there are plenty of candidates out there to get the message through.
You can trace absent landlords - all private landlords that let property in Scotland are required to register their contact details. This legislation was brought in precisely to tackle absent landlords who failed to pay for repairs and deal with their anti-social tenants.
Glasgow City Council has the powers to order tenants of unregistered landlords to stop paying them rent. The reason for this approach is that it was found that the fines issued to those breaching HMO legislation were not a deterrent to landlords, therefore the witholding of rent was designed to flush them out and hit them where it hurts - their pocket.
It may have changed now but over a year ago, Glasgow City Council had around 10,000 registered landlords but had not issued a single Rent Penalty Notice, nor had they prosecuted any landlord through this process, either.
The legislation to trace and punish landlords exists, so too, does the legislation that permits the council to issue statutory notices.
It's a case of whether the local council has the will or the resources to actually implement the rules and punishments they have at their disposal in Govanhill. The council has shut down one slum flat in the area and it seems there are plenty of candidates out there to get the message through.
Posted by: bluey, glasgow on 5:41pm Tue 29 Jul 08
You can trace absent landlords - all private landlords that let property in Scotland are required to register their contact details. This legislation was brought in precisely to tackle absent landlords who failed to pay for repairs and deal with their anti-social tenants.
Glasgow City Council has the powers to order tenants of unregistered landlords to stop paying them rent. The reason for this approach is that it was found that the fines issued to those breaching HMO legislation were not a deterrent to landlords, therefore the witholding of rent was designed to flush them out and hit them where it hurts - their pocket.
It may have changed now but over a year ago, Glasgow City Council had around 10,000 registered landlords but had not issued a single Rent Penalty Notice, nor had they prosecuted any landlord through this process, either.
The legislation to trace and punish landlords exists, so too, does the legislation that permits the council to issue statutory notices.
It's a case of whether the local council has the will or the resources to actually implement the rules and punishments they have at their disposal in Govanhill. The council has shut down one slum flat in the area and it seems there are plenty of candidates out there to get the message through.
You can trace absent landlords - all private landlords that let property in Scotland are required to register their contact details. This legislation was brought in precisely to tackle absent landlords who failed to pay for repairs and deal with their anti-social tenants.
Glasgow City Council has the powers to order tenants of unregistered landlords to stop paying them rent. The reason for this approach is that it was found that the fines issued to those breaching HMO legislation were not a deterrent to landlords, therefore the witholding of rent was designed to flush them out and hit them where it hurts - their pocket.
It may have changed now but over a year ago, Glasgow City Council had around 10,000 registered landlords but had not issued a single Rent Penalty Notice, nor had they prosecuted any landlord through this process, either.
The legislation to trace and punish landlords exists, so too, does the legislation that permits the council to issue statutory notices.
It's a case of whether the local council has the will or the resources to actually implement the rules and punishments they have at their disposal in Govanhill. The council has shut down one slum flat in the area and it seems there are plenty of candidates out there to get the message through.
Posted by: Eh?, Glasgow on 6:59pm Tue 29 Jul 08
As a landlord in Govanhill I'd like to add my piece. Firstly lets not tar all landlords with the same brush. When I bought the flat I replaced the windows, decorared and fitted central heating to the property prior to renting it our to a tenant. Having rented flats with no heating when younger I would suggest that it should be mandatory on all landlords to install central heating in a property where possible. Govanhill HA should be forced to do this also. Too many of their properties are not heated adaquatly
Strict guideleines on what is habitable should be enforced. Those who do not meet these criteria should get one warning. A second visit should then be made and if issues have not been resolved the flat /house should be purchased under compulsory purchase order at 50% of the market value.
I lived in Govanhill for a long time and loved the area and still do. All this talk of flattening the blocks is absurd. These buildings are essentially sound and will last far longer than the type of flats being constructed all over the city and marketed as luxury apartments. What makes Govanhill vobrant is firstly the architecture and layout of the area. The local shops / pub0 / cafes build a community. Secondly the diversity of the area is also a strong point.
Where the deterioation has happened is in the city council not sending road sweepers and bin men round regularly. Walk down Pollockshiels (the expensive part) on any given day and you will see road sweepers sweeping streets which have a low population density and little rubbish yet G'hill does not receive such attention with a massively hire population density. Also, the closure of the swimming pool and the utter lack of investment in the area has led to a decline. However it is still a good vibrant area but needs attention
G'Hill should be given special status. It has survived as a community despite everything that has been thrown at it while other less fortunate areas such as Springburn have disintegrated at the pen of city planners and ineffective representation.
We need to simply blame landlords and tenants. Though it is part the council and Scot Govt need to take action and G'Hill will grow as an area.
As a landlord in Govanhill I'd like to add my piece. Firstly lets not tar all landlords with the same brush. When I bought the flat I replaced the windows, decorared and fitted central heating to the property prior to renting it our to a tenant. Having rented flats with no heating when younger I would suggest that it should be mandatory on all landlords to install central heating in a property where possible. Govanhill HA should be forced to do this also. Too many of their properties are not heated adaquatly
Strict guideleines on what is habitable should be enforced. Those who do not meet these criteria should get one warning. A second visit should then be made and if issues have not been resolved the flat /house should be purchased under compulsory purchase order at 50% of the market value.
I lived in Govanhill for a long time and loved the area and still do. All this talk of flattening the blocks is absurd. These buildings are essentially sound and will last far longer than the type of flats being constructed all over the city and marketed as luxury apartments. What makes Govanhill vobrant is firstly the architecture and layout of the area. The local shops / pub0 / cafes build a community. Secondly the diversity of the area is also a strong point.
Where the deterioation has happened is in the city council not sending road sweepers and bin men round regularly. Walk down Pollockshiels (the expensive part) on any given day and you will see road sweepers sweeping streets which have a low population density and little rubbish yet G'hill does not receive such attention with a massively hire population density. Also, the closure of the swimming pool and the utter lack of investment in the area has led to a decline. However it is still a good vibrant area but needs attention
G'Hill should be given special status. It has survived as a community despite everything that has been thrown at it while other less fortunate areas such as Springburn have disintegrated at the pen of city planners and ineffective representation.
We need to simply blame landlords and tenants. Though it is part the council and Scot Govt need to take action and G'Hill will grow as an area.
Posted by: jonny bond, glasgow on 8:35pm Tue 29 Jul 08
I want to live in govanhole but the landlord wouldnt rent me and my 27 relatives a 2 bedroom. I think he should be jailed anyone agree.
I want to live in govanhole but the landlord wouldnt rent me and my 27 relatives a 2 bedroom. I think he should be jailed anyone agree.
Posted by: trench, possilpark on 10:14pm Tue 29 Jul 08
i just hope the run down flats that are in the news, belonging to the inept landlords are fixed up before the games in glasgow in a few years,will be made presentable, otherwise can you imagine the publicity that will be in the newspapers throughout the whole world?i also hope the places that are 'hoatching' are deloused as i do not think our foreign visitors would appreciate keepsakes of the unclean variety!
i just hope the run down flats that are in the news, belonging to the inept landlords are fixed up before the games in glasgow in a few years,will be made presentable, otherwise can you imagine the publicity that will be in the newspapers throughout the whole world?i also hope the places that are 'hoatching' are deloused as i do not think our foreign visitors would appreciate keepsakes of the unclean variety!
Posted by: trench, possilpark on 10:29pm Tue 29 Jul 08
i notice that the word...cockroach has been accepted in 3 letters, whereas in a letter i wrote the first4 letters were dotted out, are you guys taking the mickey?...if these readers are allowed to write COCKroaches then so should i be allowed ha ha its the same as **** as in cat ,,that is not allowed either....funny that!(maybe we should have more **** cats to catch the cockroaches, there you go ,i never said a word out of place.!
i notice that the word...cockroach has been accepted in 3 letters, whereas in a letter i wrote the first4 letters were dotted out, are you guys taking the mickey?...if these readers are allowed to write COCKroaches then so should i be allowed ha ha its the same as **** as in cat ,,that is not allowed either....funny that!(maybe we should have more **** cats to catch the cockroaches, there you go ,i never said a word out of place.!
Posted by: tam-m, southside on 12:42am Wed 30 Jul 08
funny that these cesspits could be rented to glaswegians for years and nobody gave a toss.
rented out to immigrants and all hell breaks loose.
as for the family of cockroaches living in a wardrobe ,could the tennants not spray the wardrobe or is that beneath them.
have to go got a fly in my house need phone the council and see if they will send someone round to kill it.
funny that these cesspits could be rented to glaswegians for years and nobody gave a toss.
rented out to immigrants and all hell breaks loose.
as for the family of cockroaches living in a wardrobe ,could the tennants not spray the wardrobe or is that beneath them.
have to go got a fly in my house need phone the council and see if they will send someone round to kill it.
Posted by: Stereotypical Glaswegian, Glasgow on 3:32am Wed 30 Jul 08
When is the action squad from Hollyrood led by Stewart Maxwel reporting back? It seems obvious to everyone here what should be done.
IMPLEMENT THE LAW THAT EXISTS.
Doesn't matter to us who is scratching whose political back - get it done!
When is the action squad from Hollyrood led by Stewart Maxwel reporting back? It seems obvious to everyone here what should be done.
IMPLEMENT THE LAW THAT EXISTS.
Doesn't matter to us who is scratching whose political back - get it done!
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 9:07am Wed 30 Jul 08
Yes the point above about the landlords AND tenants is a good one that points to a two pronged solution. The landlords who are 'at it' should feel the force of the law but on the tenants' side well that's a different story. Landlords cannot be responsible for the way that people choose to live their lives and by dumping their rubbish on the street that's what people are doing, making a choice and a concsience one at that. Glasgow City Council may take a bit longer to come and get the rubbish say compared with a factor but at least they will come and get it. I don't see the problem becasue one a tenant reports the location of rubbish to the Council then it is their responsibility NOT the tenants.
As for lazy tenants who continue to think that they're at liberty to dump rubbish in communal areas well they should think about the affects that it has on others. Is it too much to ask that people dispose of their rubbish, I mean it's not like their being asked to run a full marathon that they haven't trained for. I just don't get the laziness of some tenants and I am sick of all this self appointed liberty stuff becasue the freedom to do certain things often results in someone else's misery.
Yes the point above about the landlords AND tenants is a good one that points to a two pronged solution. The landlords who are 'at it' should feel the force of the law but on the tenants' side well that's a different story. Landlords cannot be responsible for the way that people choose to live their lives and by dumping their rubbish on the street that's what people are doing, making a choice and a concsience one at that. Glasgow City Council may take a bit longer to come and get the rubbish say compared with a factor but at least they will come and get it. I don't see the problem becasue one a tenant reports the location of rubbish to the Council then it is their responsibility NOT the tenants.
As for lazy tenants who continue to think that they're at liberty to dump rubbish in communal areas well they should think about the affects that it has on others. Is it too much to ask that people dispose of their rubbish, I mean it's not like their being asked to run a full marathon that they haven't trained for. I just don't get the laziness of some tenants and I am sick of all this self appointed liberty stuff becasue the freedom to do certain things often results in someone else's misery.
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 9:21am Wed 30 Jul 08
And at the risk of sounding a little bit authoritarian, if a minority are going to put the wider public health at risk - let's face it fly tipping spreads diseases - then why shouldn't they be MADE to change their ways? If not then are we saying that we should tolerate fly tipping in our communities and simply complain about it all the time? Sod that! How about stopping the moaning and identifying these tenants (we know who they are) and simply explaining to them the consequences of their fly tipping action. If they don't care about others then they should be moved out and into a different area where they can live with other fly tippers, this way they won't ruin it for others who want to live in a clean environment and last I heard this is not a crime.
And at the risk of sounding a little bit authoritarian, if a minority are going to put the wider public health at risk - let's face it fly tipping spreads diseases - then why shouldn't they be MADE to change their ways? If not then are we saying that we should tolerate fly tipping in our communities and simply complain about it all the time? Sod that! How about stopping the moaning and identifying these tenants (we know who they are) and simply explaining to them the consequences of their fly tipping action. If they don't care about others then they should be moved out and into a different area where they can live with other fly tippers, this way they won't ruin it for others who want to live in a clean environment and last I heard this is not a crime.
Posted by: underover, govanhill on 10:08am Wed 30 Jul 08
to atrocityexhibition, the tenants are not lazy ---- they are roma. huge cultural differences between what we think is a disgusting pile of rat infested rubbish and what they see as a childrens play area. to make a real difference round here the roma have to get out of govanhill, otherwise the overcrowding,dumping of rubbish anywhere and everywhere, disorder in the streets, feral children running wild and throwing and smashing the rubbish put out in the street all over the place will only continue. as the article said these people are from shantytowns and they seem to have no qualms about turning govanhill into one.
to atrocityexhibition, the tenants are not lazy ---- they are roma. huge cultural differences between what we think is a disgusting pile of rat infested rubbish and what they see as a childrens play area. to make a real difference round here the roma have to get out of govanhill, otherwise the overcrowding,dumping of rubbish anywhere and everywhere, disorder in the streets, feral children running wild and throwing and smashing the rubbish put out in the street all over the place will only continue. as the article said these people are from shantytowns and they seem to have no qualms about turning govanhill into one.
Posted by: BLOCKEM, Glasgow on 10:35am Wed 30 Jul 08
Govanhill was on the way down some ten years. Circa this time the Evening Times reported of ‘seven thousand Glasgow pre-war homes, inhabited by Glaswegians which are unsanitary and riddled with damp and rot.’ The photographs of slum houses with this article were of Allison St. and Annette St., Govanhill. There were also reports of thousands of homeless people in Glasgow. Instead of working on the deprivation problems in Govanhill, our councillors opted to create farther slum conditions and reduce the area to the unhealthy, disease-ridden hole it is now.
They did two financial deals, totaling £250,000,000 (sic) of British taxpayers’ money with the Home Office to accommodate asylum seekers in Glasgow (the only Scottish constituency out of 32 to do so) They then agreed to take the immigrants from the Eastern bloc (Roma et al) and dumped them and their offspring in Govanhill and its schools. The immigrants from the Eastern bloc were in Britain legally, they could have chosen to live anywhere in Britain. Why did our city councillors bring them to Glasgow and Govanhill? Money?
Solution now is to reduce the number of persons living in Govanhill. Offload the failed asylum seekers and the recent arrival of immigrants. Alternative is allow Govanhill to deteriorate into filth, which means disease, which means - cholera?
Other solution is for the decent people to vacate Govanhill and let Glasgow City Council build Scotland’s first? ghetto.
Fantasy? It’s happening.
Govanhill was on the way down some ten years. Circa this time the Evening Times reported of ‘seven thousand Glasgow pre-war homes, inhabited by Glaswegians which are unsanitary and riddled with damp and rot.’ The photographs of slum houses with this article were of Allison St. and Annette St., Govanhill. There were also reports of thousands of homeless people in Glasgow. Instead of working on the deprivation problems in Govanhill, our councillors opted to create farther slum conditions and reduce the area to the unhealthy, disease-ridden hole it is now.
They did two financial deals, totaling £250,000,000 (sic) of British taxpayers’ money with the Home Office to accommodate asylum seekers in Glasgow (the only Scottish constituency out of 32 to do so) They then agreed to take the immigrants from the Eastern bloc (Roma et al) and dumped them and their offspring in Govanhill and its schools. The immigrants from the Eastern bloc were in Britain legally, they could have chosen to live anywhere in Britain. Why did our city councillors bring them to Glasgow and Govanhill? Money?
Solution now is to reduce the number of persons living in Govanhill. Offload the failed asylum seekers and the recent arrival of immigrants. Alternative is allow Govanhill to deteriorate into filth, which means disease, which means - cholera?
Other solution is for the decent people to vacate Govanhill and let Glasgow City Council build Scotland’s first? ghetto.
Fantasy? It’s happening.
Posted by: underover, govanhill on 11:42am Wed 30 Jul 08
gosh i didn't know that. the council got paid to take in the roma. and you are right all the decent people are escaping fast there are lots of for sale and to let signs up. the council are a bunch of cretins
gosh i didn't know that. the council got paid to take in the roma. and you are right all the decent people are escaping fast there are lots of for sale and to let signs up. the council are a bunch of cretins
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 12:10pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Yes 'underover' you have a very good point and it's a shame that decent folk have to look at fly tips becasue of others being cultural different. I don't think that anyone has a problem with cultural difference per se but in the case of fly tipping the difference is clearly a problem that if unchecked might get much worse. Sorry to hear that.
All this liberal talk supporting the idea that people should not have to change their ways or that they have a basic right to live their lives they way they choose. This is fine but when personal choices negatively affect others and public health more generally then fly tippers are being purely selfish irrespective of their cultural differences.
BLOCKEM's point is a good one but I wasn't in the least bit surprised to learn that Glasgow City Council got paid to dump the roma into Govanhill. My question to Mr. Purcell is what happened to the £250,000,000 (sic) that the Council got to receive these culturaly different residents? By today's standards this may not be amount of money but surely even the smallest of financial contributions could be used to make a difference in Govanhill. Purcell's problem is that he is too focussed on the Commonwealth Games at the expense of more pressing and basic everyday issues.
Yes 'underover' you have a very good point and it's a shame that decent folk have to look at fly tips becasue of others being cultural different. I don't think that anyone has a problem with cultural difference per se but in the case of fly tipping the difference is clearly a problem that if unchecked might get much worse. Sorry to hear that.
All this liberal talk supporting the idea that people should not have to change their ways or that they have a basic right to live their lives they way they choose. This is fine but when personal choices negatively affect others and public health more generally then fly tippers are being purely selfish irrespective of their cultural differences.
BLOCKEM's point is a good one but I wasn't in the least bit surprised to learn that Glasgow City Council got paid to dump the roma into Govanhill. My question to Mr. Purcell is what happened to the £250,000,000 (sic) that the Council got to receive these culturaly different residents? By today's standards this may not be amount of money but surely even the smallest of financial contributions could be used to make a difference in Govanhill. Purcell's problem is that he is too focussed on the Commonwealth Games at the expense of more pressing and basic everyday issues.
Posted by: mto, glasgow on 1:28pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Sorry, Blockem, you're talking complete tosh and Undercover/atrocity exhibition - more fool you for believing this nonsense.
Whether you like it or not, Slovakian Roma have the right to be in Britain/Scotland/Gla
sgow because of EU rules that grant individual citizens freedom of movement throughout the member states.
Those Eastern Europeans in Glasgow will have come by their own violition, been tempted by unscrupulous gangmasters who may well work closely with equally unscrupulous landlords to ease exploitation or have heard about Glasgow through word of mouth.(For instance, the Roma in Glasgow tend to come from two villages in Slovakia.)
This is a situation that is ultimately driven by forces that operate at a far higher level than a Scottish local authority and so Glasgow, as a city within the European Union, has no say in whether the Roma come here or not.
Sorry, Blockem, you're talking complete tosh and Undercover/atrocity exhibition - more fool you for believing this nonsense.
Whether you like it or not, Slovakian Roma have the right to be in Britain/Scotland/Gla
sgow because of EU rules that grant individual citizens freedom of movement throughout the member states.
Those Eastern Europeans in Glasgow will have come by their own violition, been tempted by unscrupulous gangmasters who may well work closely with equally unscrupulous landlords to ease exploitation or have heard about Glasgow through word of mouth.(For instance, the Roma in Glasgow tend to come from two villages in Slovakia.)
This is a situation that is ultimately driven by forces that operate at a far higher level than a Scottish local authority and so Glasgow, as a city within the European Union, has no say in whether the Roma come here or not.
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 1:46pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Yo mto
No one is disputing the fact about the rights of the Roma to locate in Glasgow or anywhere else for that matter and had you of read my earlier post you would realise that I am not being as foolish as you claim. I fully appreciate the supra national point that you allude to in your message. I know exactly what EU membership entails.
Can you understand that someone else's liberty to do something, fly tipping in this case, can have negative effects on others? It doesn't matter that they are Roma, Irish or whatever. The point is that a minority are potentially putting the public health by fly tipping.
So while Roma people have the right to live in Glasgow they do not along with anyone else have the right to fly tip because of the negative consequences. If you are unsure what these consequences are then ask your local environmental health officer.
Yo mto
No one is disputing the fact about the rights of the Roma to locate in Glasgow or anywhere else for that matter and had you of read my earlier post you would realise that I am not being as foolish as you claim. I fully appreciate the supra national point that you allude to in your message. I know exactly what EU membership entails.
Can you understand that someone else's liberty to do something, fly tipping in this case, can have negative effects on others? It doesn't matter that they are Roma, Irish or whatever. The point is that a minority are potentially putting the public health by fly tipping.
So while Roma people have the right to live in Glasgow they do not along with anyone else have the right to fly tip because of the negative consequences. If you are unsure what these consequences are then ask your local environmental health officer.
Posted by: mto, glasgow on 3:04pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Atrocity Exhibition,
You said:-
"I wasn't in the least bit surprised to learn that Glasgow City Council got paid to dump the roma into Govanhill."
This seems to me a very different position to your subsequent statement:-
"No one is disputing the fact about the rights of the Roma to locate in Glasgow."
If a Roma, or a Scotsman, is free to be here or anywhere else in the European Union, then why would anyone pay for that to happen?
But then if it were true - which it isn't - then who would make that payment, how much was it for, by what means or funding stream was it paid by, what is the money to be used for and where is the record of this supposed payment?
There are no answers to these questions, because none of it happened.
Come on, Blockem's claim was so outlandish, yet you accepted it right of the bat without any apparent question.
Please interrogate harder.
I made no reference to fly-tipping or environmental health in my original post.
But as you have now directed a comment to me then I will say that I have no argument with you on that particular point.
Atrocity Exhibition,
You said:-
"I wasn't in the least bit surprised to learn that Glasgow City Council got paid to dump the roma into Govanhill."
This seems to me a very different position to your subsequent statement:-
"No one is disputing the fact about the rights of the Roma to locate in Glasgow."
If a Roma, or a Scotsman, is free to be here or anywhere else in the European Union, then why would anyone pay for that to happen?
But then if it were true - which it isn't - then who would make that payment, how much was it for, by what means or funding stream was it paid by, what is the money to be used for and where is the record of this supposed payment?
There are no answers to these questions, because none of it happened.
Come on, Blockem's claim was so outlandish, yet you accepted it right of the bat without any apparent question.
Please interrogate harder.
I made no reference to fly-tipping or environmental health in my original post.
But as you have now directed a comment to me then I will say that I have no argument with you on that particular point.
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 4:48pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Agreed mto yup good point there but my two claims which you extracted in your last post above are actually variations on the same position. Blockem's comment may have been outlandish but when seen in the light of a cash strapped City Council I am not so sure. The City Council see Glasgow as a series of spaces, take 'brownfield sites' for eg., to extract economic value from. Just look at the way thay have let the private sector run riot and that's only in the housing market so I think that the City Council are more despreate for cash and underbounded that a lot of people think. Have you ever heard the term the 'crisis of crisis management'? The amount of responsibilities that have been downloaded onto Glasgow City Council and other local authories is shameful because they don't have the finances to carry out these extra duties most effectively. But of course Glasgow City Council had had little option but to become more entrepreneurial and we have Thatcher to thank for that. I mean do you think that the 2014 Commonwealth Games won't make money at least for the council who will hopefully distribute it.
Anyway we are getting off the point but did you say that you have evidence to dispute Blockem's claim or did I miss that?
Agreed mto yup good point there but my two claims which you extracted in your last post above are actually variations on the same position. Blockem's comment may have been outlandish but when seen in the light of a cash strapped City Council I am not so sure. The City Council see Glasgow as a series of spaces, take 'brownfield sites' for eg., to extract economic value from. Just look at the way thay have let the private sector run riot and that's only in the housing market so I think that the City Council are more despreate for cash and underbounded that a lot of people think. Have you ever heard the term the 'crisis of crisis management'? The amount of responsibilities that have been downloaded onto Glasgow City Council and other local authories is shameful because they don't have the finances to carry out these extra duties most effectively. But of course Glasgow City Council had had little option but to become more entrepreneurial and we have Thatcher to thank for that. I mean do you think that the 2014 Commonwealth Games won't make money at least for the council who will hopefully distribute it.
Anyway we are getting off the point but did you say that you have evidence to dispute Blockem's claim or did I miss that?
Posted by: mto, glasgow on 5:49pm Wed 30 Jul 08
Evidence of something that didn't exist?!!
An interesting idea - we're almost getting into Rumsfeldian territory here with his unknown unknowns.
So sadly I can't point to a bit of paper that says 'The council weren't paid to have the Roma dumped in Govanhill', which given the alleged conspiracy would be ridiculous.
But surely it's up to Blockem, or maybe even yourself, to provide some justification for his/her allegation in the first place?
Otherwise there's just an anarchy of opinion, hearsay, speculation, myth and rumour, which is not really any use to anyone.
I'd already posed what I think are reasonable questions about this issue.
So fair's fair - you (or Blockem) first!
Crisis of crisis management? I'll look into that one. Shouldn't be too hard. I imagine there's a lot of it about.
Evidence of something that didn't exist?!!
An interesting idea - we're almost getting into Rumsfeldian territory here with his unknown unknowns.
So sadly I can't point to a bit of paper that says 'The council weren't paid to have the Roma dumped in Govanhill', which given the alleged conspiracy would be ridiculous.
But surely it's up to Blockem, or maybe even yourself, to provide some justification for his/her allegation in the first place?
Otherwise there's just an anarchy of opinion, hearsay, speculation, myth and rumour, which is not really any use to anyone.
I'd already posed what I think are reasonable questions about this issue.
So fair's fair - you (or Blockem) first!
Crisis of crisis management? I'll look into that one. Shouldn't be too hard. I imagine there's a lot of it about.
Posted by: bluey, glasgow on 6:28pm Wed 30 Jul 08
The council don't need to plead to be given more powers but to actually use the ones that are already in place that are neglected. If it's the case that they know that housing is in a squalid condition, they should be arranging compulsory repair notices and billing the owners and issuing Rent Penalty Notices to tenants of landlords that try to hide from their responsibilities.
Why aren't they using existing legislation to enforce repairs and payment of them instead of begging for tax payers cash to remedy neglect that they have helped rogue landlords to foster?
The council don't need to plead to be given more powers but to actually use the ones that are already in place that are neglected. If it's the case that they know that housing is in a squalid condition, they should be arranging compulsory repair notices and billing the owners and issuing Rent Penalty Notices to tenants of landlords that try to hide from their responsibilities.
Why aren't they using existing legislation to enforce repairs and payment of them instead of begging for tax payers cash to remedy neglect that they have helped rogue landlords to foster?
Posted by: BLOCKEM, Glasgow on 7:07pm Wed 30 Jul 08
I note my comment has raised a few questions.
First of all, the £250,000,000 (sic) was payment received by Glasgow City Council for the accommodation of an initial 475 asylum seekers in this city for a first payment of £120,000,000 (sic). A second deal was made with the Home Office for an additional £130,000,000 (sic) All British taxpayers’ money - total £250,000,000. The deal was made under the National Dispersal Scheme to distribute asylum seekers throughout Britain. This deal was made only in relation to asylum seekers who now total circa 6,000 - 8,000 in Glasgow. There are circa 1100 failed asylum seeking families (4,500 including dependents) who refuse point blank to leave Britain although they have been informed that they have no legal right, or ever had, to be here.
Second. In my posting I stated, ‘‘The immigrants from the Eastern bloc were in Britain legally,’’ I am in agreement that “Slovakian Roma have the right to be in Britain/Scotland/Gla
sgow because of EU rules that grant individual citizens freedom of movement throughout the member states.’’ Also, I never stated that Glasgow City Council received payment for bringing immigrants from the Eastern Bloc to Glasgow, I raised the question:- ‘‘Why did our city councillors bring them to Glasgow and Govanhill? Money?’’
In passing, whilst the Eastern Bloc immigrants may have the ‘‘right’’ to come to Glasgow, Scotland and Britain, our citizens have a ‘‘right’’ to live in areas which are not being polluted with filth and disease from immigrants. Glasgow City Council is now aware of that which is happening, our councillors should now deport those immigrants as undesirables who are unable to live to our standards.
I note my comment has raised a few questions.
First of all, the £250,000,000 (sic) was payment received by Glasgow City Council for the accommodation of an initial 475 asylum seekers in this city for a first payment of £120,000,000 (sic). A second deal was made with the Home Office for an additional £130,000,000 (sic) All British taxpayers’ money - total £250,000,000. The deal was made under the National Dispersal Scheme to distribute asylum seekers throughout Britain. This deal was made only in relation to asylum seekers who now total circa 6,000 - 8,000 in Glasgow. There are circa 1100 failed asylum seeking families (4,500 including dependents) who refuse point blank to leave Britain although they have been informed that they have no legal right, or ever had, to be here.
Second. In my posting I stated, ‘‘The immigrants from the Eastern bloc were in Britain legally,’’ I am in agreement that “Slovakian Roma have the right to be in Britain/Scotland/Gla
sgow because of EU rules that grant individual citizens freedom of movement throughout the member states.’’ Also, I never stated that Glasgow City Council received payment for bringing immigrants from the Eastern Bloc to Glasgow, I raised the question:- ‘‘Why did our city councillors bring them to Glasgow and Govanhill? Money?’’
In passing, whilst the Eastern Bloc immigrants may have the ‘‘right’’ to come to Glasgow, Scotland and Britain, our citizens have a ‘‘right’’ to live in areas which are not being polluted with filth and disease from immigrants. Glasgow City Council is now aware of that which is happening, our councillors should now deport those immigrants as undesirables who are unable to live to our standards.
Posted by: BLOCKEM, Glasgow on 9:14pm Wed 30 Jul 08
[quote][bold]mto,[/bold] glasgow posted: Sorry, Blockem, you're talking complete tosh[/quote]
Prior to accusing anyone of ‘‘talking complete tosh’’ read the comment you are criticizing and take note of that which is being said. I trust my second comment at 7:07pm today will have enlightened you.
Also, Glasgow, as a city may not have a say as to whom comes here, (other than asylum seekers). This raises the question, why do the Roma choose Glasgow? My view is that as Glasgow has now become the biggest dumping ground outside of London for asylum seekers and due to our councillors refusal to assist our Home Office in removing failed asylum seekers, the ‘‘unscrupulous gangmasters’’ will have selected Glasgow as their dropping off point for their cargo. (Glasgow, like Britain, is regarded as a soft touch).
mto, glasgow posted: Sorry, Blockem, you're talking complete tosh
Prior to accusing anyone of ‘‘talking complete tosh’’ read the comment you are criticizing and take note of that which is being said. I trust my second comment at 7:07pm today will have enlightened you.
Also, Glasgow, as a city may not have a say as to whom comes here, (other than asylum seekers). This raises the question, why do the Roma choose Glasgow? My view is that as Glasgow has now become the biggest dumping ground outside of London for asylum seekers and due to our councillors refusal to assist our Home Office in removing failed asylum seekers, the ‘‘unscrupulous gangmasters’’ will have selected Glasgow as their dropping off point for their cargo. (Glasgow, like Britain, is regarded as a soft touch).
Posted by: atrocityexhibition, Glasgow on 10:50am Thu 31 Jul 08
Hi BLOCKEM and many thanks for clarifying your point and in the unlikely event that mto needs further convincing then he/she can always get in touch with Home Office.
Hi BLOCKEM and many thanks for clarifying your point and in the unlikely event that mto needs further convincing then he/she can always get in touch with Home Office.
Posted by: BLOCKEM, Glasgow on 10:58pm Thu 31 Jul 08
Hi atrocityexhibition, I don’t think we’ll be receiving a reply comment from mto and as you say, he/she can contact our Home Office ... and Glasgow City Council ... and accuse them of ‘‘talking complete tosh’’.
Hi atrocityexhibition, I don’t think we’ll be receiving a reply comment from mto and as you say, he/she can contact our Home Office ... and Glasgow City Council ... and accuse them of ‘‘talking complete tosh’’.
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